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	<title>Comments on: 33 Years After Roe</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/</link>
	<description>In defense of the sanctimonious women&#039;s studies set.</description>
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		<title>By: Constance Reader</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/#comment-30062</link>
		<dc:creator>Constance Reader</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Jan 2006 15:53:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/#comment-30062</guid>
		<description>&lt;a&gt;&quot;&gt;Here&#039;s my post as well,&lt;/a&gt; in which I make the argument that the absolute last thing the pro-life movement is interested in is life.  I think that should be an important tactic for the pro-women&#039;s reproductive choice to adopt:  the pro-life movement has no real interest in life whatsoever.

Maybe if enough of our blog posts get passed around, if enough of us wear the t-shirts and tell our stories, just maybe we can get past the fear and anguish at the use of  plain English words and proper medical terms and actually have honest discussions of the issue.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a>&#8220;&gt;Here&#8217;s my post as well,</a> in which I make the argument that the absolute last thing the pro-life movement is interested in is life.  I think that should be an important tactic for the pro-women&#8217;s reproductive choice to adopt:  the pro-life movement has no real interest in life whatsoever.</p>
<p>Maybe if enough of our blog posts get passed around, if enough of us wear the t-shirts and tell our stories, just maybe we can get past the fear and anguish at the use of  plain English words and proper medical terms and actually have honest discussions of the issue.</p>
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		<title>By: Lane</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/#comment-30053</link>
		<dc:creator>Lane</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Jan 2006 14:28:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/#comment-30053</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;em&gt;Never mind that those unprotected women were having sex with men who couldn’t be bothered to take responsibility for unintended conception and use a condom. It’s always our fault, isn’t it?&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Well, if women insisting on taking control of the abortion decision process (which is all that I&#039;ve ever heard from pro-choicers: that only those with uterus&#039; can decide), then why shouldn&#039;t they take the responsibility to protect themselves? If she doesn&#039;t want to get pregnant, she shouldn&#039;t sleep with someone who refuses to use a condom.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p><em>Never mind that those unprotected women were having sex with men who couldn’t be bothered to take responsibility for unintended conception and use a condom. It’s always our fault, isn’t it?</em></p></blockquote>
<p>Well, if women insisting on taking control of the abortion decision process (which is all that I&#8217;ve ever heard from pro-choicers: that only those with uterus&#8217; can decide), then why shouldn&#8217;t they take the responsibility to protect themselves? If she doesn&#8217;t want to get pregnant, she shouldn&#8217;t sleep with someone who refuses to use a condom.</p>
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		<title>By: Alice M.</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/#comment-29829</link>
		<dc:creator>Alice M.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Jan 2006 15:27:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/#comment-29829</guid>
		<description>Thanks for this.

I wonder if the part of the reason for the abortion debate being so different in the U.S. vs the rest of the world is because of the legal framework. Here in the U.K., if I understand correctly, abortion was legalised on a pragmatic basis - because too many hospital beds were taken up by women injured or dying from illegal abortions. (Of course hospital care is a matter of the national budget here because we have the National Health Service.) Whereas in the U.S. I think the legality comes from a &#039;rights&#039; issue, which puts the arguments on a different footing. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for this.</p>
<p>I wonder if the part of the reason for the abortion debate being so different in the U.S. vs the rest of the world is because of the legal framework. Here in the U.K., if I understand correctly, abortion was legalised on a pragmatic basis &#8211; because too many hospital beds were taken up by women injured or dying from illegal abortions. (Of course hospital care is a matter of the national budget here because we have the National Health Service.) Whereas in the U.S. I think the legality comes from a &#8216;rights&#8217; issue, which puts the arguments on a different footing.</p>
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		<title>By: Eric Martin</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/#comment-29602</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric Martin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Jan 2006 20:58:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/#comment-29602</guid>
		<description>Fantastic post.  I don&#039;t have anything more profound to say than that.  Oh, and nice to see another NYU alum in the &#039;sphere.  Keep up the good work.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fantastic post.  I don&#8217;t have anything more profound to say than that.  Oh, and nice to see another NYU alum in the &#8216;sphere.  Keep up the good work.</p>
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		<title>By: Lauren</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/#comment-29575</link>
		<dc:creator>Lauren</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Jan 2006 19:36:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/#comment-29575</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Bit what I rarely hear the prochoicers discuss is a woman who has had three abortions, doesn’t use much birth control, and may have more. This woman (and she does exist; I know people like her) is the epitome of the problem from the prolife perspective. You need to develop more taliing [opints about HER instead of always bringing up the rape victim.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Zippy, doll, I&#039;ll just point you &lt;a href=&quot;http://melancholicfeminista.blogspot.com/2006/01/happy-birthday-roe-and-thank-you.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;.

Jill, this is, in a word, fantastic.  The point that needs to be beaten on every drum:
&lt;blockquote&gt;The reality is that, &lt;strong&gt;even if every single person uses contraception to prevent unintended pregnancies, there will still be a need for abortion.&lt;/strong&gt; There will be extreme fetal abnormalities. There will still be life-threatening pregnancies. There will still be pregnancies resulting from rape and incest. There will still be contraceptive failures. There will still be mid-pregnancy personal tragedies that turn a wanted pregnancy into an impossible one. This is life. Abortion, like sex and pregnancy and childbirth and miscarriage, will always be a part of it.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I have repeatedly detailed my experience with HELLP syndrome because a) it was traumatic and I like talking about the gristly details, and b) to bring us back to this point.  Even if I am responsible, use birth control, and mark my next baby onto the calendar with a pen, there is the chance that my next pregnancy will kill me.  A dead mother is no good to an existing family with children, and the reality is that a dead fetus -- or the tragic abortion of a baby that was wanted by the parents -- is a far lesser evil than a family abandoned because of draconian moral absolutes applied to medical law.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Bit what I rarely hear the prochoicers discuss is a woman who has had three abortions, doesn’t use much birth control, and may have more. This woman (and she does exist; I know people like her) is the epitome of the problem from the prolife perspective. You need to develop more taliing [opints about HER instead of always bringing up the rape victim.</p></blockquote>
<p>Zippy, doll, I&#8217;ll just point you <a href="http://melancholicfeminista.blogspot.com/2006/01/happy-birthday-roe-and-thank-you.html" rel="nofollow">here</a>.</p>
<p>Jill, this is, in a word, fantastic.  The point that needs to be beaten on every drum:</p>
<blockquote><p>The reality is that, <strong>even if every single person uses contraception to prevent unintended pregnancies, there will still be a need for abortion.</strong> There will be extreme fetal abnormalities. There will still be life-threatening pregnancies. There will still be pregnancies resulting from rape and incest. There will still be contraceptive failures. There will still be mid-pregnancy personal tragedies that turn a wanted pregnancy into an impossible one. This is life. Abortion, like sex and pregnancy and childbirth and miscarriage, will always be a part of it.</p></blockquote>
<p>I have repeatedly detailed my experience with HELLP syndrome because a) it was traumatic and I like talking about the gristly details, and b) to bring us back to this point.  Even if I am responsible, use birth control, and mark my next baby onto the calendar with a pen, there is the chance that my next pregnancy will kill me.  A dead mother is no good to an existing family with children, and the reality is that a dead fetus &#8212; or the tragic abortion of a baby that was wanted by the parents &#8212; is a far lesser evil than a family abandoned because of draconian moral absolutes applied to medical law.</p>
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		<title>By: 21stCenturyMom</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/#comment-29564</link>
		<dc:creator>21stCenturyMom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Jan 2006 18:30:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/#comment-29564</guid>
		<description>Thanks for this wonderfully written and long post.  You have done a remarkable job of synthesizing a lot of important aspects of why we need to fight for choice.  

As for the Op Ed piece, I love this one  &lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;em&gt;at least half of our unintended pregnancies are attributable to women who didn’t use contraception&lt;/em&gt;. &lt;/blockquote&gt;

Never mind that those unprotected women were having sex with men who couldn&#039;t be bothered to take responsibility for unintended conception and use a condom.  It&#039;s always our fault, isn&#039;t it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for this wonderfully written and long post.  You have done a remarkable job of synthesizing a lot of important aspects of why we need to fight for choice.  </p>
<p>As for the Op Ed piece, I love this one<br />
<blockquote><em>at least half of our unintended pregnancies are attributable to women who didn’t use contraception</em>. </p></blockquote>
<p>Never mind that those unprotected women were having sex with men who couldn&#8217;t be bothered to take responsibility for unintended conception and use a condom.  It&#8217;s always our fault, isn&#8217;t it?</p>
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		<title>By: Fraser</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/#comment-29561</link>
		<dc:creator>Fraser</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Jan 2006 18:21:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/#comment-29561</guid>
		<description>Screwed up my post: The line I reference was &quot;abstinence for those who can practice it, contraception for those who can&#039;t.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Screwed up my post: The line I reference was &#8220;abstinence for those who can practice it, contraception for those who can&#8217;t.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: feckless</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/#comment-29557</link>
		<dc:creator>feckless</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Jan 2006 18:13:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/#comment-29557</guid>
		<description>The problem with this concept of outreach, and I agree it is the only way to preserve choice, taking a political stand to limit the number of abortions while absolutely preserving access, the same people who are &quot;pro-life&quot; are &quot;abstinence only&quot; (this can be seen in the red state school curriculars and the horrible abuse of our foreign aid under the W junta).

I see a heavy overlap in the intelligent design, pro-life, abstinence only, poverty is a sign of moral failing crowd, this a hard voting 20% of the population, and they are just plain ignorant and mean.

How do you convert these people back to sanity?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The problem with this concept of outreach, and I agree it is the only way to preserve choice, taking a political stand to limit the number of abortions while absolutely preserving access, the same people who are &#8220;pro-life&#8221; are &#8220;abstinence only&#8221; (this can be seen in the red state school curriculars and the horrible abuse of our foreign aid under the W junta).</p>
<p>I see a heavy overlap in the intelligent design, pro-life, abstinence only, poverty is a sign of moral failing crowd, this a hard voting 20% of the population, and they are just plain ignorant and mean.</p>
<p>How do you convert these people back to sanity?</p>
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		<title>By: Fraser</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/#comment-29542</link>
		<dc:creator>Fraser</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Jan 2006 16:57:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/#comment-29542</guid>
		<description>&gt;

This line jumped out at me. Does this mean that if you &quot;can&quot; practice abstinence but have sex with birth control anyway, you&#039;re a slut?

Which is one thing that should be kept in mind, some of the religiout right aren&#039;t just anti-abortion, the&#039;yre anti-birth control and pretty much anti-sex (one of Operation Rescue&#039;s leaders once described sex with your spouse while using contraceptive as being morally equivalent to renting a prostitute). Locally, plenty of people (and I&#039;m sure my area isn&#039;t alone) portray abortion as a way for women to escape the consequences of all that slutty sex they&#039;ve been having.

Another point, will overturning Roe really turn abortion rights back to the states? The religious right managed to turn the Terri Schiavo case into a national issue, and the Bush administration has actively pushed national laws over states on other matters (environmental law, for instance). I foresee a big push to stamp out the unspeakable evil of abortion rather than allow evil blue-staters to continue permitting women to have sex and not suffer for it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt;</p>
<p>This line jumped out at me. Does this mean that if you &#8220;can&#8221; practice abstinence but have sex with birth control anyway, you&#8217;re a slut?</p>
<p>Which is one thing that should be kept in mind, some of the religiout right aren&#8217;t just anti-abortion, the&#8217;yre anti-birth control and pretty much anti-sex (one of Operation Rescue&#8217;s leaders once described sex with your spouse while using contraceptive as being morally equivalent to renting a prostitute). Locally, plenty of people (and I&#8217;m sure my area isn&#8217;t alone) portray abortion as a way for women to escape the consequences of all that slutty sex they&#8217;ve been having.</p>
<p>Another point, will overturning Roe really turn abortion rights back to the states? The religious right managed to turn the Terri Schiavo case into a national issue, and the Bush administration has actively pushed national laws over states on other matters (environmental law, for instance). I foresee a big push to stamp out the unspeakable evil of abortion rather than allow evil blue-staters to continue permitting women to have sex and not suffer for it.</p>
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		<title>By: media in trouble</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/#comment-29540</link>
		<dc:creator>media in trouble</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Jan 2006 16:55:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2006/01/23/33-years-after-roe/#comment-29540</guid>
		<description>There is a fine book just released by NARAL&#039;s &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0465054897/ref=ase_naralprochoic-20/104-6853715-1939921?v=glance&amp;s=books&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Cristina Page: How The Pro-choice Movement Saved America &lt;/a&gt;.

It covers the Pro-Choice movement and where we stand on reproductive rights in this country and how the pro-life movement really isn&#039;t about stopping abortions or even reducing them.

Its about women being baby factories.

It would be wise to promote this book and review it and such.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is a fine book just released by NARAL&#8217;s <a href="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0465054897/ref=ase_naralprochoic-20/104-6853715-1939921?v=glance&amp;s=books" rel="nofollow">Cristina Page: How The Pro-choice Movement Saved America </a>.</p>
<p>It covers the Pro-Choice movement and where we stand on reproductive rights in this country and how the pro-life movement really isn&#8217;t about stopping abortions or even reducing them.</p>
<p>Its about women being baby factories.</p>
<p>It would be wise to promote this book and review it and such.</p>
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