Wow, every single time this issue comes up I’m amazed at how many women come out of the woodwork to share thier pain – finding a fitting bra seems to be a near universal struggle among western women.

That said – a lot of you who are having trouble getting the right fit to a bra, this little factoid may help. Almost every single set of bra fitting instructions that I’ve found either on line or in the lingerie departments at stores is WRONG.

Almost all of them have some complex formula for calculating the bra size, but really what they do is estimate what commonly available bra size you can get away with – not what acutally fits. That’s because even most stores speciallizing in plus sizes don’t carry anycup larger than a D or DD. The last time I used one of those calculators it told me I was a 48D (I’m a 42F, possibly even a 40G since my band size changes by a good inch or two over the course of a year). To the person who quoted a half sphere 8″ in diameter and 4″ tall as ridiculous – that pretty much describes my breasts and as you can see, some stores would call these girls a D. (You could maybe shave off half an inch each way – though I realize that that reduces the volume/mass by the cube).

Most bras are true to band measurement – the width of your chest under the breasts (not under the armpits and over the breasts, nor chest measurement plus 4-5″ – two common recomendations.) A band that fits is key because that’s where the majority of the support is supposed to come from – NOT the straps (in my best fitting bra I can slip the straps off without losing much support). And as someone pointed out above, once you get above a D, cup sizes are not standard so you have to try them on and see how they look and feel. Underwires should fit against the breast bone in the middle(!), the cups should be full and smooth but you shouldn’t be overflowing them, and the band should not be riding up in the back. The style and cut can also make a huge difference towards the fit – for example, I simply can’t wear demi-cup, plunge or pushup styles because my breasts aren’t firm enough. I need full coverage.

Intimacy has a great web site that goes over some of the most common bra fitting mistakes (http://www.myintimacy.com/bramistake.html). It’s geared at selling their services, but it’s also full of good information. When I finally got a bra that fit I was amazed at how comfortable it was.

On the other hand, those of you who prefer to go without – Go You! I wish I could join you but I’m not even comfortable lounging around the house without a bra.

It’s definitely true that back/shoulder/chest-strengthening exercises can help alleviate some of the painful effects from carrying around the weight of large breasts, but they won’t make any difference when it comes to the uncomfortable movement that happens when one isn’t wearing a bra.

Especially for those of us on the floppier side, a bra helps to redistribute the weight of the breasts so that the back and shoulder muscles are less stressed–something that can’t be accomplished solely with exercise (and believe me, I’ve tried.)

The only time I’m comfortable without a bra for long periods is when I’m reclining or my breasts are being supported some other way (like with a pillow)–otherwise I find that constant pulling feelind distracting and painful. I’ve joked many times about hiring someone to walk around behind me and carry my boobs for me–no bra needed then! :)

The pectoral muscles do not really do all that much to support the breasts, especially larger breasts. If you look at a good cross-section drawing of a breast, that becomes very obvious, as the pectoral muscle runs *under* the breast tissue, not through or around it in anyway. What *is* supporting the majority of the weight of the breast tissue is the skin and connective tissue around the mass of fat/ductwork/connective tissue that actually makes up the breast. This is why as we get older, the girls start to sag, more or less depending on (cup) size, base of the breast size (wider based breasts just tend to sag less in general than more narrowly based breasts), weight fluctuations, pregnancy/breastfeeding, and your own genetic make-up. That skin that is holding up the majority of the weight is, for most women, as delicate as the skin under the eyes. That is, not very strong/elastic at all.

Strengthening the pectoral muscles will not help support the breasts all that much. Smaller breasted gals may get a little lift, but for most of us, not so much. I’m not sure I agree with putting young girls into bras *before* their breasts start to develop, but for many girls, the developing breasts are quite tender, and a bra may help with discomfort at that point, too. Much like many women find that wearing a bra when their breasts are tender around their periods can be more comfortable. So no, I don’t believe in any way that wearing bras makes us *dependent* upon them for support, as there are no muscles integrally involved in breast support to begin with. There may be a measure of psychological comfort for some folks involved, but that is going to be an individual thing.

*Please note, I’m not a doctor or any other sort of health professional. However, I do work with women’s breast support issues almost every day of my professional life as a costumer/custom seamstress. I also have a fairly decent science background. Really — look at the anatomical drawings if you don’t believe me. Breasts “float” (in as much as ANY part of your body floats) *above* the chest muscles. For there to be any sort of support factor involved, the muscle would at the very least need to cup under the mass of tissue at the bottom of the breast, or perhaps wrap around it from the upper outside edge to the lower inside edge. That’s just basic engineering, of either sort.

And I’m one of them, and am quite comfortable, even running and jogging, without a bra. I just think, if you’re at the point where the bra is a major gain in comfort (whether because of breast size, or build, or whatever), I’d say wear the bra.

How much of the discomfort that leads to “needing” a bra comes from being put in a bra as soon as breasts begin to develop, or even earlier, so there is no chance for the body to adapt to the new weight of the breasts?

It’s possible that’s part of it, and that some, or even many, girls might do well not getting bras as early as they get them.

Why? If you’re comfortable with a bra, why go to a great deal of trouble to maybe become comfortable without one? It’s not as if the bra is intrinsically crippling, like foot-binding or something.

Well, finding a bra that does the job well seems to be a major problem for a lot of women here. Bra-wearing seems to bring on its own discomforts, such as digging bra straps, wandering underwires, or just not having the right fit to provide enough support. Bras, in general, seem to be a far from perfect solution to the problem of breast discomfort.

If something can be done so that the bra isn’t essential for comfort, or so that a wider range of bra variations provide the needed support because the body can handle more of the weight, it would give more options, and greater comfort.

How much of the discomfort that leads to “needing” a bra comes from being put in a bra as soon as breasts begin to develop, or even earlier, so there is no chance for the body to adapt to the new weight of the breasts? Making women artificially dependant on a commercial product for their comfort.

My bras are 44D, but my mother didn’t take me to buy my first bra until I was already in a B cup, and I’ve never worn bras for more than half of my waking hours. I can be quite comfortable without a bra, for activities short of running or jogging. How much of that is because by not wearing a bra much, my body developed the strength to handle the weight of my breasts? I’m not sure, being a non-scientific sample of one, but my hunch is that there is something to it.

Why? If you’re comfortable with a bra, why go to a great deal of trouble to maybe become comfortable without one? It’s not as if the bra is intrinsically crippling, like foot-binding or something.

Edith, the clavicle thing is shocking in a way that grooves from bra straps aren’t. Plus, are you serious about muscle building up? Breasts are not made of muscle tissue, so no matter how you build up your pecs, your breasts aren’t going to be perky. Go read piny’s posts about his breasts if you’re not clear on this.

Excuse me. Chesticles. Only I may call them breasts.*

I don’t think she argued that they will make them perkyn like acorn squash–although exercises that build up the pectorals and back/core muscles can make your rack look a little perkier, even if they won’t actually change the shape of the boobs themselves.

That having been said, we-must-type exercises usually aren’t even a little bit strenuous.

And I felt uncomfortable running downstairs even after my pecs were freakin’ huge and everything else had shrunk down to a low a-cup. It was bouncy and shocky and weird. It might not be solely due to weight and muscle support.

Oh, and so friggin’ what, we’re all from the West? Very nice. *rolls eyes*

It’s a discussion by bra-wearers about the utility of the bra. Other options don’t enter into it because there’s not much personal experience with them and also because it wasn’t, “Is there a rational reason to support one’s boobage?” but, “Is the bra a concession to patriarchy?”

*I’m kidding, just so we’re absolutely clear and also so that no one actually calls them chesticles.

Plus, are you serious about muscle building up? Breasts are not made of muscle tissue, so no matter how you build up your pecs, your breasts aren’t going to be perky.

The breasts themselves may not get stronger muscles, but the muscles of the back, shoulders, arms and chest can get stronger, leading to more comfort without a bra.

The analogy might be that always wearing a very supportive bra is a bit like always using a wheelchair – you’re leg muscles, and your breast-support muscles, can’t gain strength if they are never used.

I wonder if some sort of physical therapy could be developed to have exercise that help women be more comfortable without needing a bra?

The point would not be “perkiness” but rather having the muscle strength to bear the necessary load with ease. The end result might not be attractive in a conventionally western sense. If you think about National Geographic photos of women in cultures that don’t wear bras, breasts tend to be more pointed and hanging than the western ideal.