Comments on: Sorority upholds the sisterhood of the white, the pretty and the thin http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/02/26/sorority-upholds-the-sisterhood-of-the-white-pretty-and-thin/ In defense of the sanctimonious women's studies set. Fri, 10 Feb 2012 13:14:04 +0000 hourly 1 By: bmc90 http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/02/26/sorority-upholds-the-sisterhood-of-the-white-pretty-and-thin/#comment-89963 bmc90 Thu, 01 Mar 2007 16:21:30 +0000 http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/02/26/sorority-upholds-the-sisterhood-of-the-white-pretty-and-thin/#comment-89963 I don't see how women who have been in these sorts of environments for 4 years come out with any kind of self esteem - maybe a very fragile one if they fit the bill, but I'm guessing they end up getting very stressed about aging. One of the more fun things about my school is that those who had been floating by on their looks and male attention for years suddenly got that rug pulled right out from under them. Some could not handle it and transferred, which was good riddance as far as I was concerned. But if you stayed and made it (the academics were brutal), you realized you can get by without all that stuff if you have to, and let's face it, I don't really want to be worrying about whether I am still "hot" in my 70's. The women who went to these schools just had the looks thing reinforced for 4 years while they were struggling to form their identies as grownups. Yikes. I don’t see how women who have been in these sorts of environments for 4 years come out with any kind of self esteem – maybe a very fragile one if they fit the bill, but I’m guessing they end up getting very stressed about aging. One of the more fun things about my school is that those who had been floating by on their looks and male attention for years suddenly got that rug pulled right out from under them. Some could not handle it and transferred, which was good riddance as far as I was concerned. But if you stayed and made it (the academics were brutal), you realized you can get by without all that stuff if you have to, and let’s face it, I don’t really want to be worrying about whether I am still “hot” in my 70′s. The women who went to these schools just had the looks thing reinforced for 4 years while they were struggling to form their identies as grownups. Yikes.

]]> By: Morgan http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/02/26/sorority-upholds-the-sisterhood-of-the-white-pretty-and-thin/#comment-89796 Morgan Wed, 28 Feb 2007 23:31:14 +0000 http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/02/26/sorority-upholds-the-sisterhood-of-the-white-pretty-and-thin/#comment-89796 huh. i went to The College of William in Mary (which was in a small southern town, and somehow we carved out an alternative), and the Phi Mu sorority did the dame thing when i was a jr or sr. nationals kicked out all the original girls and recruited conventionally attractive ones to take their place. this was in, say, 1997, 1998. the majority of women at my college were sorority women, so i encountered them from time to time. many of them were very sweet girls, if somewhat culturally bland, who wanted a way to meet friends, meet boys, and drink beer. however, they were often forced to overlook horrible things. my roommate was a closeted lesbian who lived in terror that her openly homophobic sisterhood would learn the truth about her and kick her out. you can imagine the effect this had on her psyche and her alcohol consumption. and yes, a lot of them do the fat circling thing and blatantly reject girls based on $ and race. so as for it being a feminist, or not-anti-feminist experience, i don't know. that's a lot to sign off on. huh. i went to The College of William in Mary (which was in a small southern town, and somehow we carved out an alternative), and the Phi Mu sorority did the dame thing when i was a jr or sr. nationals kicked out all the original girls and recruited conventionally attractive ones to take their place. this was in, say, 1997, 1998.

the majority of women at my college were sorority women, so i encountered them from time to time. many of them were very sweet girls, if somewhat culturally bland, who wanted a way to meet friends, meet boys, and drink beer. however, they were often forced to overlook horrible things. my roommate was a closeted lesbian who lived in terror that her openly homophobic sisterhood would learn the truth about her and kick her out. you can imagine the effect this had on her psyche and her alcohol consumption. and yes, a lot of them do the fat circling thing and blatantly reject girls based on $ and race. so as for it being a feminist, or not-anti-feminist experience, i don’t know. that’s a lot to sign off on.

]]> By: micheyd http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/02/26/sorority-upholds-the-sisterhood-of-the-white-pretty-and-thin/#comment-89725 micheyd Wed, 28 Feb 2007 20:02:59 +0000 http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/02/26/sorority-upholds-the-sisterhood-of-the-white-pretty-and-thin/#comment-89725 Yeah, I was kidding about the upstate NY thing - it's definitely a "dark side of Greek life" problem. We had an excellent discussion or two about the body-marking ritual in our campus feminist group though. Yeah, I was kidding about the upstate NY thing – it’s definitely a “dark side of Greek life” problem. We had an excellent discussion or two about the body-marking ritual in our campus feminist group though.

]]> By: Erin http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/02/26/sorority-upholds-the-sisterhood-of-the-white-pretty-and-thin/#comment-89716 Erin Wed, 28 Feb 2007 19:18:25 +0000 http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/02/26/sorority-upholds-the-sisterhood-of-the-white-pretty-and-thin/#comment-89716 Where I went to college, all organizations had to be inclusive, but there was a grandfather (hmmm) clause for any organization that had been in existence before 1970 - which was the first year that women enrolled at the school. Where I went to college, all organizations had to be inclusive, but there was a grandfather (hmmm) clause for any organization that had been in existence before 1970 – which was the first year that women enrolled at the school.

]]> By: twosoakers http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/02/26/sorority-upholds-the-sisterhood-of-the-white-pretty-and-thin/#comment-89715 twosoakers Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:50:35 +0000 http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/02/26/sorority-upholds-the-sisterhood-of-the-white-pretty-and-thin/#comment-89715 Not sure about it being an upstate thing---these girls were mainly from NYC/Long Island and the rich 'burbs around New England. Not sure about it being an upstate thing—these girls were mainly from NYC/Long Island and the rich ‘burbs around New England.

]]> By: micheyd http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/02/26/sorority-upholds-the-sisterhood-of-the-white-pretty-and-thin/#comment-89713 micheyd Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:04:52 +0000 http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/02/26/sorority-upholds-the-sisterhood-of-the-white-pretty-and-thin/#comment-89713 <blockquote>One sorority—with their black BMW’s or Cherokees, and “EAT” (what their letters reminded me) stamped to their asses </blockquote> That must be SDT (yes, unfortunate jokes abounded). I heard they did the same humiliation technique at Cornell too. Hmm, must be an upstate NY thing.

One sorority—with their black BMW’s or Cherokees, and “EAT” (what their letters reminded me) stamped to their asses

That must be SDT (yes, unfortunate jokes abounded). I heard they did the same humiliation technique at Cornell too. Hmm, must be an upstate NY thing.

]]> By: bmc90 http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/02/26/sorority-upholds-the-sisterhood-of-the-white-pretty-and-thin/#comment-89712 bmc90 Wed, 28 Feb 2007 17:54:25 +0000 http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/02/26/sorority-upholds-the-sisterhood-of-the-white-pretty-and-thin/#comment-89712 I am so glad I spent at least 4 years of my life in a place where no one cared if you wore makeup or the same sweatshirt for an entire week. When I went to law school at a big state university with a greek system, I lived in grad apartments on greek row. The women going in and out of those houses had to have spent hours on their hair and makeup each day, and that's just when they were on their way to the gym (which was state of the art, though the library hadn't been remodeled since my parents attended the same school). Now that I am in the corporate world, I have to look the part, but at least I got a break at some point. I am so glad I spent at least 4 years of my life in a place where no one cared if you wore makeup or the same sweatshirt for an entire week. When I went to law school at a big state university with a greek system, I lived in grad apartments on greek row. The women going in and out of those houses had to have spent hours on their hair and makeup each day, and that’s just when they were on their way to the gym (which was state of the art, though the library hadn’t been remodeled since my parents attended the same school). Now that I am in the corporate world, I have to look the part, but at least I got a break at some point.

]]> By: twosoakers http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/02/26/sorority-upholds-the-sisterhood-of-the-white-pretty-and-thin/#comment-89705 twosoakers Wed, 28 Feb 2007 15:28:59 +0000 http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/02/26/sorority-upholds-the-sisterhood-of-the-white-pretty-and-thin/#comment-89705 Then again, the good ol' "U of R," rumoredly, would hire "hot chicks" to wander around campus with books and university apparel, posing as students, to lure prospective students to campus, because of some men's "magazine" poll that decided that Rochester's women undergrads were some of the ugliest around. I didn't believe it at the start of my freshman year, but it was true! You'd see these women strolling about during "Spring Open Campus" weeks, but if you'd follow them, they'd never go into a classroom, and after these weeks end, they disappear! Then again, the good ol’ “U of R,” rumoredly, would hire “hot chicks” to wander around campus with books and university apparel, posing as students, to lure prospective students to campus, because of some men’s “magazine” poll that decided that Rochester’s women undergrads were some of the ugliest around. I didn’t believe it at the start of my freshman year, but it was true! You’d see these women strolling about during “Spring Open Campus” weeks, but if you’d follow them, they’d never go into a classroom, and after these weeks end, they disappear!

]]> By: twosoakers http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/02/26/sorority-upholds-the-sisterhood-of-the-white-pretty-and-thin/#comment-89703 twosoakers Wed, 28 Feb 2007 15:03:39 +0000 http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/02/26/sorority-upholds-the-sisterhood-of-the-white-pretty-and-thin/#comment-89703 Of all the nasty things I heard frats requiring their pledges to do (Sigma Chi showers, or the "ookie cookie", for example), when I was at the University of Rochester, I was apalled by what some sororities did to their pledges---they were just like a pack of animals. One sorority---with their black BMW's or Cherokees, and "EAT" (what their letters reminded me) stamped to their asses, would get their pledges to strip down to their bras and panties, and would be individually scrutinized by the sisters, and marked with their "problem areas" with black permanent marker. Hair on your lip? "Lemme fill that in for you." Tits too small, tits too big, thighs, tummies, butts, not fake tanned enough, knobby knees... You hear these things from people you meet that drop out of the system, but nothing gets done because of shame, or fear of reprisal. It's just like rape/sexual assault---you hear of a case here and there, but how much more actually does happen, and goes unreported becuase of the same reasons (shame, guilt...) Get me out of this midwestern state! Of all the nasty things I heard frats requiring their pledges to do (Sigma Chi showers, or the “ookie cookie”, for example), when I was at the University of Rochester, I was apalled by what some sororities did to their pledges—they were just like a pack of animals. One sorority—with their black BMW’s or Cherokees, and “EAT” (what their letters reminded me) stamped to their asses, would get their pledges to strip down to their bras and panties, and would be individually scrutinized by the sisters, and marked with their “problem areas” with black permanent marker. Hair on your lip? “Lemme fill that in for you.” Tits too small, tits too big, thighs, tummies, butts, not fake tanned enough, knobby knees… You hear these things from people you meet that drop out of the system, but nothing gets done because of shame, or fear of reprisal. It’s just like rape/sexual assault—you hear of a case here and there, but how much more actually does happen, and goes unreported becuase of the same reasons (shame, guilt…) Get me out of this midwestern state!

]]> By: MDtoMN http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/02/26/sorority-upholds-the-sisterhood-of-the-white-pretty-and-thin/#comment-89697 MDtoMN Wed, 28 Feb 2007 14:09:58 +0000 http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/02/26/sorority-upholds-the-sisterhood-of-the-white-pretty-and-thin/#comment-89697 My undergrad had a minimal frat scene. Now, I'm at Michigan for grad school, and I sometimes envy the frat guys. I know I would have hated it at 18, but now it seems much more appealing . . . A couple of my friends were in black sororities. It sounds like a great experience to me, though I certainly would hesitate to say that they weren't image conscious - all of them suggest that the institutions were heavily image conscious. Of course, the term they use most often is "lady" which I find fascinating. There seems to be a real emphasis on being sufficiently adult and mature, academic and sophisticated. At the same time, they all report significant focus on appearances, looks, and presentation. I guess I would summarize by saying that the black sororities sound much more pleasant than the white ones, but still like a mixed bag. My fraternity brother friends seem to have had a REALLY varied experience - I suspect that frats run a broader gamut, possibly because of more pressure for boys to join a frat and more socially acceptable roles for boys allowing more diversity in frats. Personally, I wish I had been in a left-wing or gay fraternity. If only . . . My undergrad had a minimal frat scene. Now, I’m at Michigan for grad school, and I sometimes envy the frat guys. I know I would have hated it at 18, but now it seems much more appealing . . .

A couple of my friends were in black sororities. It sounds like a great experience to me, though I certainly would hesitate to say that they weren’t image conscious – all of them suggest that the institutions were heavily image conscious. Of course, the term they use most often is “lady” which I find fascinating. There seems to be a real emphasis on being sufficiently adult and mature, academic and sophisticated. At the same time, they all report significant focus on appearances, looks, and presentation. I guess I would summarize by saying that the black sororities sound much more pleasant than the white ones, but still like a mixed bag.

My fraternity brother friends seem to have had a REALLY varied experience – I suspect that frats run a broader gamut, possibly because of more pressure for boys to join a frat and more socially acceptable roles for boys allowing more diversity in frats.

Personally, I wish I had been in a left-wing or gay fraternity. If only . . .

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