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	<title>Comments on: Haven&#8217;t we heard this before?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/</link>
	<description>In defense of the sanctimonious women&#039;s studies set.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 10 Feb 2012 12:24:43 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: IrrationalPoint</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/#comment-105394</link>
		<dc:creator>IrrationalPoint</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 May 2007 19:53:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/#comment-105394</guid>
		<description>Sorry, when I said &quot;mainstream Western media&quot; I mean feminist mainstream Western media.  As in media from mainstream feminist groups

I am on mailing lists for a number of feminist organisation, and the  &quot;mainstream&quot; groups tend, for example, to send out a lot more stuff on reproductive rights than, say, access to sanitary products for women in Zimbabwe.  Or FGM.  Or women on welfare in the US.  Or very much about any issue that concerns non-Western women or non-middle-class women more than it does Western middle class women.

So I&#039;m not basing my observation on the media, I&#039;m basing it on my experience of mainstream feminist groups&#039; own mailings and activities.

Bluestockings and Mnemosyne:  I appreciate the carricature, but I don&#039;t see how much original comment provoked your responses, I&#039;m afraid.  I&#039;m not supporting the conservative strawfeminist argument, but I do think that there is a valid point to be made about the bias of mainstream feminism in wealthy Western countries.

--IP</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry, when I said &#8220;mainstream Western media&#8221; I mean feminist mainstream Western media.  As in media from mainstream feminist groups</p>
<p>I am on mailing lists for a number of feminist organisation, and the  &#8220;mainstream&#8221; groups tend, for example, to send out a lot more stuff on reproductive rights than, say, access to sanitary products for women in Zimbabwe.  Or FGM.  Or women on welfare in the US.  Or very much about any issue that concerns non-Western women or non-middle-class women more than it does Western middle class women.</p>
<p>So I&#8217;m not basing my observation on the media, I&#8217;m basing it on my experience of mainstream feminist groups&#8217; own mailings and activities.</p>
<p>Bluestockings and Mnemosyne:  I appreciate the carricature, but I don&#8217;t see how much original comment provoked your responses, I&#8217;m afraid.  I&#8217;m not supporting the conservative strawfeminist argument, but I do think that there is a valid point to be made about the bias of mainstream feminism in wealthy Western countries.</p>
<p>&#8211;IP</p>
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		<title>By: preying mantis</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/#comment-105045</link>
		<dc:creator>preying mantis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 May 2007 11:52:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/#comment-105045</guid>
		<description>&quot;You know, I read that “abstinence of evidence” - which I think is pretty also apt for today’s media .&quot;

They&#039;re certainly a lot better at it than those poor kids that get suckered into thinking a chastity pledge is the only sex-ed they need.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;You know, I read that “abstinence of evidence” &#8211; which I think is pretty also apt for today’s media .&#8221;</p>
<p>They&#8217;re certainly a lot better at it than those poor kids that get suckered into thinking a chastity pledge is the only sex-ed they need.</p>
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		<title>By: SunlessNick</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/#comment-105042</link>
		<dc:creator>SunlessNick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 May 2007 11:38:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/#comment-105042</guid>
		<description>Should have been &quot;read that &lt;em&gt;as&lt;/em&gt;&quot; of course.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Should have been &#8220;read that <em>as</em>&#8221; of course.</p>
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		<title>By: SunlessNick</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/#comment-105041</link>
		<dc:creator>SunlessNick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 May 2007 11:37:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/#comment-105041</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;I believe the phrase is “Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.”   &lt;strong&gt;-  preying mantis&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;You know, I read that &quot;abstinence of evidence&quot; - which I think is pretty also apt for today&#039;s media .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>I believe the phrase is “Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.”   <strong>-  preying mantis</strong></p></blockquote>
<p>You know, I read that &#8220;abstinence of evidence&#8221; &#8211; which I think is pretty also apt for today&#8217;s media .</p>
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		<title>By: Danyell</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/#comment-105008</link>
		<dc:creator>Danyell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 May 2007 01:58:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/#comment-105008</guid>
		<description>If people think feminists are falling behind why don&#039;t THEY pick up the slack?






Answer: Because then they can&#039;t blame feminists when they make it even worse!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If people think feminists are falling behind why don&#8217;t THEY pick up the slack?</p>
<p>Answer: Because then they can&#8217;t blame feminists when they make it even worse!</p>
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		<title>By: Mnemosyne</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/#comment-104999</link>
		<dc:creator>Mnemosyne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 May 2007 00:58:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/#comment-104999</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;We don’t here nearly as many mentions of women in Afghanistan in the mainstream Western media as we do of, say abortion rights in Western countries.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

So &quot;mentions in the media&quot; is what makes activism, not actual actions?

I see you&#039;ve been consulting with the Iraqi government, which has decided that if no one takes pictures of the bombing, the bombing never happened.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>We don’t here nearly as many mentions of women in Afghanistan in the mainstream Western media as we do of, say abortion rights in Western countries.</p></blockquote>
<p>So &#8220;mentions in the media&#8221; is what makes activism, not actual actions?</p>
<p>I see you&#8217;ve been consulting with the Iraqi government, which has decided that if no one takes pictures of the bombing, the bombing never happened.</p>
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		<title>By: preying mantis</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/#comment-104996</link>
		<dc:creator>preying mantis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 May 2007 00:30:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/#comment-104996</guid>
		<description>&quot;We don’t here nearly as many mentions of women in Afghanistan in the mainstream Western media as we do of, say abortion rights in Western countries.&quot;

I believe the phrase is &quot;Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;We don’t here nearly as many mentions of women in Afghanistan in the mainstream Western media as we do of, say abortion rights in Western countries.&#8221;</p>
<p>I believe the phrase is &#8220;Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: bluestockingsrs</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/#comment-104988</link>
		<dc:creator>bluestockingsrs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 May 2007 23:52:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/#comment-104988</guid>
		<description>Well, if I could type AND edit today that first sentence would say:

IP, you have decided that only the subjects that the media pays attention to are the subjects that US feminists advocate on exclusively. This just ain&#039;t so.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, if I could type AND edit today that first sentence would say:</p>
<p>IP, you have decided that only the subjects that the media pays attention to are the subjects that US feminists advocate on exclusively. This just ain&#8217;t so.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: bluestockingsrs</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/#comment-104986</link>
		<dc:creator>bluestockingsrs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 May 2007 23:51:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/#comment-104986</guid>
		<description>IP, you are conflating what the media pays attention to as beign the subjects that feminists are advocate about.

What the media pays attention to is not the fault of any feminist organization since last time I checked no feminist organization owned a news organization.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>IP, you are conflating what the media pays attention to as beign the subjects that feminists are advocate about.</p>
<p>What the media pays attention to is not the fault of any feminist organization since last time I checked no feminist organization owned a news organization.</p>
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		<title>By: IrrationalPoint</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/#comment-104980</link>
		<dc:creator>IrrationalPoint</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 May 2007 22:56:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2007/05/15/havent-we-heard-this-before/#comment-104980</guid>
		<description>While I don&#039;t wish to defend conservative what-about-ery, I do think that there is a legitimate point to be made regarding biases in Western feminism.

A lot of &quot;mainstream&quot; feminist organisations campaign primarily on issues that affect straight white middle-class non-disabled  citizens of [insert name of wealthy Western country here].  We don&#039;t here nearly as many mentions of women in Afghanistan in the mainstream Western media as we do of, say abortion rights in Western countries.

So yes, by all means call conservatives on their hypocrisy.  But it&#039;s a bit hard to see American feminists as champions of women in Afghanistan.  Because what most American feminists do for women in Afghanistan is basically zero compared for what most American feminists do for, say, middle-class Americans.

--IP

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>While I don&#8217;t wish to defend conservative what-about-ery, I do think that there is a legitimate point to be made regarding biases in Western feminism.</p>
<p>A lot of &#8220;mainstream&#8221; feminist organisations campaign primarily on issues that affect straight white middle-class non-disabled  citizens of [insert name of wealthy Western country here].  We don&#8217;t here nearly as many mentions of women in Afghanistan in the mainstream Western media as we do of, say abortion rights in Western countries.</p>
<p>So yes, by all means call conservatives on their hypocrisy.  But it&#8217;s a bit hard to see American feminists as champions of women in Afghanistan.  Because what most American feminists do for women in Afghanistan is basically zero compared for what most American feminists do for, say, middle-class Americans.</p>
<p>&#8211;IP</p>
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