So I screwed up.
I wrote this in the post about how Giuliani is out of touch:
I don’t know what it’s like in Noo Yawk Siddee, where hamburgers cost twenty dollars and the taxi drivers charge to stab you with their crack pipes on the way to the Marriott, but here in California we’re edging up on four dollars a gallon….
And Holly took offense:
Yeah, what Zuzu said. I walk by a gas station every day on the way to the subway, but damned if I can remember the price. How the hell would I know how much a gallon of gas is? Even if I did, what would that mean to me? I don’t have any idea of how many gallons of gas people have to buy every month to commute or go other places, what gas mileage is like in your average car these days, etc. I totally have no clue, nor do I really want to, I haven’t driven regularly since I was a teenager, I rarely ever take cabs because they’re too pricey and sometimes scary late at night (and apparently our cabbies smoke crack?! wtf piny?) It’s all train, bus, bicycle, and foot for me.
I was gonna just put my response in comments as follows:
No, no, not at all! It was a riff on the Big City that might as well be another planet trope that the rest of the country seems to resort to so often when discussing your hometown. It’d make more sense, admittedly, if I actually came from a small town myself, as opposed to an urban/suburban setup with its own expensive albeit distinct car culture. But you’ve probably heard similar stuff in earnest, right down to the barely-coded racism, so I’ll just take this opportunity to apologize.
And I was thinking, Hey, we just had a disagreement and I apologized for saying something that was misunderstood. This bears a striking resemblance to recent events, up to a point. Maybe someone else will point it out–in fact, someone already did something similar.
And then I thought some more, and I realized that it’s not very similar after all.
(Given everything I’m about to go into, I really want Holly to understand that I’m speaking as Hypothetical Blogger here, not as myself. I would be devastated were I to lose Holly’s respect.)
So I offended her. What if I had said something much worse? What if I had said something nasty about Holly herself? She couldn’t hurt me.
On the other hand, what if I’d decided to fuck her over? What if she’d said something offensive to me? What if she’d, oh, complained about some insensitive throwaway comment I’d made, and I decided that I didn’t like people criticizing me? What if I’d decided to write a post about what an asshole she is and how y’all should all go over there and make her miserable–in fact, I don’t think I’d even need to state that part in as many words–because she needed to be taught a lesson? I don’t think every one of my readers would even bother to fact-check me, even if the things I was saying didn’t happen to be true. That’s not how the blogosphere works, is it? I’d probably get a lot of mileage out of a couple of spurious accusations and a small, vocal subset of asshole commenters, and Holly might be driven off her blog for a few days or weeks. Maybe I’d poison the well for good. I’ve built up a lot of trust over the past year and change, and nothing prevents me from abusing it.
This is why this bothers me so much–and why I’m bothered by the idea of going after someone’s head. This is what blogs are for, now? This is the real purpose of a comments thread?
Yes, I meant SEK. MEK is an American supported-Iranian Terrorist Group. Freudian slip? Maybe, I don’t know.
It was a misunderstanding, and the easiest thing would be for me to apologize and move on, but I don’t think I did anything wrong. It’s a tragedy. I feel very bad about it. I was mistaken, but it was a logical mistake to make. If I had cost her her job, it would be different. I didn’t.
I’m not the type of person who refuses to apologize when he’s wrong. Do a search on my blog for apology or sorry or some similar term. You’ll find three or four apologies. Look up Santorum and fetus. I think that will lead you to one.
Maybe I’ll change my mind in a few days after putting some disance between me and the controversy, but I don’t think so. I’ve put a lot of thought into it already.
You were upset and you had every right to be upset, but you should understand that it’s not that simple. We’re talking about your actions here, not your feelings. You were mistaken. You were wrong. You didn’t know everything. None of that fallibility hindered you. You acted anyway, and your actions had some bad consequences that could have been a great deal worse. What if she had gotten fired? What if one of your commenters had been an abusive misogynist fuck as opposed to a plain old misogynist fuck? What if this had been the last straw on the post-traumatic camel’s back? It would make sense to feel bad then, but not now just because what could have happened didn’t? There’s a pretty good chance that you’ll be wrong next time, too, since you’re human. That’s why I really hope that this misunderstanding will be at the foreground of your planning phase the next time someone makes you this angry. But the way you’re responding to the new knowledge makes me wonder how many minutes will pass before you do the same thing all over again.
Whoops! Sucks to be you, huh? I might not have taken the exact same course of action if I’d known that I was gonna out you to your church, ArkansasMama, but you might have taken the trouble to let me know ahead of time! No hard feelings come Koufax season, right? Not that it matters!
She does not bear responsibility for this dogpile, because she’s not the one who went and made someone else’s life miserable. That’s you. In fact, I’m not even sure she could send a posse over to your place. She can’t retaliate. She can’t punish you for your mistakes. She couldn’t punish you even if you had been completely off-base. You get to go on your merry way and she’s left without so much as a note. Just another day in the blogosphere, as far as you’re concerned. You’ve got a weapon–and you know it, because you were happy to let volume make your case–and unilateral power to use it. You have no accountability here, and that will never change, and that’s why you have to impose some extra responsibility on yourself.
{ 15 comments }
Oh, Jesus. We’re still beating this horse? I wasn’t going to jump back in here again, but I’m just not going to let things stand.
The problem I had with your post, and ilyka’s, is that it does not allow for the possibility that two things can be true at the same time — BOTH that Brittney did something very stupid and insensitive for which she needs to apologize AND that some of the people criticizing her made misogynistic comments for which they need to apologize.
That you cannot grant that very simple concept any credence literally has me shaking with anger as I type this.
Because Brittney did something stupid, insensitive and unprofessional. She got called on it, long before anyone showed up from JG’s blog, and she offered no explanation or defense other than to tell people they were stupid.
That she got dismissed and was subject to vitriolic and misogynistic comments does not erase the original problem: she fucked up, and did not admit that she did.
And you came along and perpetuated this idea that she didn’t do anything to apologize for, that it was so *obvious* that she meant no harm, meant the post to ironically present Smantix’s post, that anyone who didn’t see that was just stupid and sticking their noses in where it didn’t belong.
And to that, I say: pog mo thoin. No matter how many times I look at that post, and others on that site, the obviousness fails to make itself obvious. No matter how many times I consider the issue, I fail to see how a bunch of Nashvillians discussing an attack on a New York blogger is purely local, Nashville issue.
So am I stupid? Deluded? You tell me.
Another thing: I guess I’m expected to take at face value Brittney’s statement that she didn’t agree with Smantix, yet I’m simultaneously supposed to discount her statements in her resignation that this really didn’t have anything to do with her decision to quit, that it was a long time in coming.
As for traffic, Ilyka mentioned on the other thread that NiT and JG have roughly the same traffic. Is this really the case of a big blogger stomping on a little blogger?
Finally, as for erasure, I see a lot of consideration for the feelings of Brittney, but I don’t see a lot of consideration for the feelings of those who knew or cared about Steve. And where is Steve in all this? I mean, other than in a cemetery in New Jersey.
For what is at least the third time: this is where I get off. It’s not the outrage, it’s the decision to act on it. And it’s not the misogynist comments, it’s the decision to go after her head in the knowledge that your commenters will help. “What are we gonna do with you, kitten?” was the least of it. And it’s the way that, “We all make mistakes” doesn’t seem to lead to, “So maybe I should be a little more careful.”
Pressure on her to resign might or might not have contributed to her decision to quit. I can say with certainty, however, that it had a lot to do with patriotboy’s decision to threaten her.
Who said it was? I do think it’s a case of a blogger using his position in his circle against an outsider, and I don’t think the tactic would really work in reverse.
I don’t think it’s appropriate to argue on Steve’s behalf from either angle.
The only appropriate, rational response is to send an email to everyone affiliated with one’s employer accusing those with whom you disagree of being white supremacists.
Piny, I belive I fall into “those who knew or cared about Steve.”
I don’t know if you’ve ever lost someone, especially a peer, but it’s raw, and it hurts, and I’m really disappointed in you that you can’t acknowledge the very real harm that Brittney caused. Whether she intended to or not is beside the point, isn’t it? She caused it. I’m telling you that *I* am feeling hurt, and angry, both as a result of her post and her — and your — failure to acknowledge that insensitivity.
But I suppose I don’t count.
Oh, fuck it. I’m done. I have to walk away from the blog or I’m going to say something I may regret. Hasta la vista.
What is this, the grudge blog now? Tortured hypotheticals dry out a debate faster than just about anything. Look, this Brittney person seems like a smart, capable writer who maybe made a mistake or maybe not. But she seems perfectly able to defend herself to the corporate media sponsor of the blog she was writing for if she thought that was necessary. She can decide when to leave her job. She can set up a blog and spend her time bashing JG if she wants to. She’s an adult, and I don’t think your portrayal of her as some hapless victim serves any useful purpose.
I respect everyone here, and the actual real emotion that they bring to these debates. I have a hard time fathoming how these things can be avoided when, even if they be beams in someone’s eye, when they are pointed out with “fuck you”, it asks a lot that everyone would be able to see past their own predictable human response of defensiveness. The rage we feel plays to our crowds of enraged readers, it may serve us well as a release valve for horrible feelings, but it ain’t gonna illuminate shit outside the choir, and it certainly won’t build a bridge.
Well, for what it’s worth, I pretty much agree with zuzu on this, which is why I bowed out of the discussion very soon after first dipping a toe in.
Not because I agree with zuzu – I’m used to doing that from time to time – just that I disagree with so many others I usually agree with, which is a fairly strange feeling. I can’t figure out why this is being played as total victim vs vicious hordes of total evil (slight exaggeration, but still), when I think that is far from the case, so I figured I’d just let it be.
Mostly ;).
This sucks. :-(
Damn.
Steve Gilliard was not a personal friend of mine but I looked up to him the same way that I look up to the better pro bono lawyers in my city: a giant who had no fear, who fought for justice.
I am in debt to this blog and I hope that “meta” and the pain that people are experiencing don’t become the last word.
I’m utterly with Zuzu on this. I’ve been trying to say as little as possible, for fear of sounding sappy, but MY WORD is there no place, is there no standing, for the effing pain of friends who have lost friends?
No, there isn’t. That’s just exactly what I’ve said, and just what piny’s said, and just what anyone else coming at this from a similar perspective has said: No one is entitled to her grief or feelings at ALL. Nor is anyone allowed to say Brittney could have been clearer in her post. It is not permissible. We just won’t have it. And we have said this because we’re mean and unfeeling people, through and through.
What? You brought the strawman, I figured I might as well dance with him.
This all totally blows. I feel like my parents are fighting or something.
Isn’t there a way we can rewind here and fix this, at least between the Feministers?
I’m less than even a small fish, ilyka, but I suppose a much easier one to fry than say, zuzu.
JG made a mistake. He isn’t interested in apologizing for it. I expected better.
That’s one of the reasons I keep coming back to Feministe with great respect. When Jill thinks that she’s made a mistake, she openly admits it, apologizes for it, and clears the air. Clearly, as in the example above, piny has the same mentality, and I suspect that Zuzu does, too.
There’s a lack of maturity in JG’s words and actions that’s really surprised me.
anyway I bashed the hell out of the rightwing shitstain who started this whole mess, even though I didn’t know Gilliard, and even though supposedly it just feeds his attention jones. so far no one’s bit. i had to say something though. christ. what is WRONG with some people? no, seriously?
maybe that’s the issue here–people have been kind of like, well, we’re hard on -you- because -you should know better-, that shitstain’s hopeless, don’t bother;
but, i dunno, seems to me in cases like this the point of flaming the shitstain isn’t any hope of getting him to understand, it’s expressing what’s on everyone’s mind and getting some affirmation that way.
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