…but underneath the skin. Via Women’s Health News, it has come to my attention that Israeli scientists have devised a technology now in testing that is, in essence, an internal bra. Internal as in underneath the skin.
Rachel was a little disturbed by the prospect (and amused by the image of the augmented pigs on which this technology is being tested), but I think it looks pretty cool. The article touts the “CupUp” as a less-invasive alternative to breast augmentation or lifts. I’ve never been interested in cosmetic surgery before, but I find the idea of not having to wear (or buy or shop for or mourn when the underwire pops out) a bra pretty intriguing. I know that I don’t have to wear a bra, but I feel a lot more comfortable with one than without. I’m going to wear a bra. Especially while in motion. For that matter, as my bust size has increased, so has my discomfort at not wearing a bra. This may even have the potential to be a much less invasive alternative to breast reduction surgery.
There are also lots of reasons it might not work. There might well be a good reason not to have our breasts cemented to our rib cages. The article suggests adding padding to the cup, to mimic the action of a push-up bra, and all my experiences with push-up bras (mercifully they have been few) have left me in pain and glad to be able to get rid of the darn thing at the end of the day. I’ve also always appreciated the nipple-hiding that a bra can do – this wouldn’t be able to manage that.
Plus, it brings up all the normal issues that go along with surgically altering women’s bodies so that they’ll conform to popular beauty norms.
Horrifying? Awesome? Horrifyingly awesome? What do you think?
Its a neat idea, but I would never get it done. I’d rather put on a bra in the morning than go through painful surgery. But I have some friends who would love it.
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Sara,
Thanks for the link. Having been through the discomfort of a couple of surgeries (for things to go out, not in), the idea of having something surgically implanted for a non-medical reason gives me the willies. I have to wonder how the body would react to this over time, but the imagination of people never ceases to amaze me.
AGH
*covers hers with both arms*
ACK ACK ACK ACK
Is there any reason why anyone might choose this over reduction if they have enough weight in the breastal area to warrant it?
Yikes …
Behold, another way to convince everyone that women’s bodies, as they are–however they are–disgust and repel all!
Hmm, $30 garment that I can choos (or not), put on/take off at will, and that has a negligible affect on my physical health, or a new, invasive and intended-to-be-permanent surgery that will make me EVEN MORE patriarchy-approved?
Hmmmmm….
See, I’d wear a bra all the time if it did nothing other than reduce the amount my boobs jubble around. And as far as unnecessary surgery goes, I think I’d rather have something put in me than taken out.
But, but…I have wee little breasts but very prominent nipples. This would do nothing for me, since I only wear a bra to avoid the extreme headlight phenomenon.
Ailei, more power to you then! I thought of that too, though – it might end up that I’d want to wear a bra for that very reason…and then I’m back to square one.
As an athlete, I think it sounds awful. It looks like it’s sewn “into” pectoral muscles … but swimming and lifting weights and yoga and things can change pectoral mass, which would make it hurt and not fit properly. If you were running (or doing anything similarly high-impact), it would mean that in addition to boob-move-age, you’d have to worry about sutures-internally-attached-to-boob-move-age, which seems like it would warrant an even more constraining sports bra than before.
Horrifying and disgusting.
Don’t want to wear a bra? Then just get your boobs removed.
Seriously, that’s how retarded this sounds to me.
Bonsai has a good point, most of my bra’s are sports bras just to keep the jiggle down and at first I thought, hey invasive but might be good, but Bonsai’s points are probably more to the truth.
Three words:
Breast cancer detection.
Also speaking to the athletic front (ahem), what happens to this thing with a good solid impact? I play full contact karate. Sticking additional things that can be broken in the middle of my target area seems like a really bad idea.
Being overly-endowed and almost never comfy w/out a bra, this sort of appeals to me, but Bonsai’s concerns seem pretty damn legitimate. Also, I wonder what this feels like? Like a hard little plastic shelf under your boobs that would make you less cuddly? Would it prevent or otherwise affect breast-feeding? What about weight gain or loss — would you have to be “resized”?
I suppose this would be considered by some to be not unlike permanent make-up. Count me out. What happens if you gain a couple of sizes huh?
Also firmly in the not-comfortable-without-a-bra camp (and frankly, can we stop suggesting that bras exist only to make boobs patriarchay-approvable? I kind of think people who say things like that have never tried to walk around bra-less with boobs like mine in the way) and am also intrigued by the idea, if not the execution.
It seems like it might be less invasive than a breast reduction/lift, where a flap of pectoral muscle is used to achieve the same effect.
I don’t see anything in the article indicating that it’s intended to replace reduction; they specifically suggested it be an alternative to lifts.
This may be an interesting method for someone already considering a breastlift: they’re already okay with a surgical procedure in the name of looking good.
Bonsai’s suggestion aside, I’m still not clear where the two cables connect. If they do indeed connect to the membrane surrounding muscle tissue, it seems like tearing could definitely be a problem. And what about weight gain or loss? Nursing? I hope they’ve actually considered boob realities.
So I wander off to make dinner before posting my comment and end up repeating ankathry. Whoops. Medical silicon is usually pretty flexible, so I don’t think it’s like a hard shell, but I wouldn’t be surprised if it feels distinctly different from the uncupped breast.
I’m rather bothered by #3 and #8′s reaction. I, of course, don’t have anything to say about someone else’s personal reaction, but I’ve heard a lot, a lot, of women talk about their dissatisfactions with their breasts in ways that are more than just ‘the patriarchy hates my tits’. Many of them are much more sophisticated and much more nuanced about their relationship to their breasts and the way their breasts move and their need, to whatever degree, for bras. In so far as this represents a way for some women to better control their lives (and their breasts), I can’t see that as anything other than good.
Of course, in so far as this represents a flawed and dangerous surgery that has deleterious long-term effects, per #7 and #10, that’s a problem. But that’s not necessarily a feminist issue (except in so far as women’s health is shortchange routinely) so much as a issue of basic medical safety.
Setting the safety and utility issues aside, I know a lot of women that would think a minimally invasive, effective way to supplement or replace their dependence on bras to move about their lives comfortably is pretty neat.
Looks like a sling—hopefully soft, some kind of fabric-like material would do—with a pair of cables. The article said it was attached to the ribs, so no worries about the muscles’ ability to support it.
Personally, I think I’d like it. I have B-C cups and it’s a downright pain in the ass to find bras that look all right and provide the support I want without being padded, which feels ungainly and ridiculous and they’re a little too big for my tastes anyway. More to the point, I wish that they’d rest a little higher, be a little rounder, when I’m naked. Not to mention the pain of jiggle troubles (specifically, I mow my grandmother’s lawn on a riding mower, it’s bumpy as hell, and I’ve never once remembered to bring a sports bra), and you know what? It’s a tremendous annoyance to me that I have to put this contraption on the outside of me, to have the support that men and lesser-endowed women simply possess free and clear—since genetics have dictated that my breasts be large enough to be ungainly and the need for support is simply there, I’d rather that the necessary fortification be inside me rather than outside. A sort of self-sufficiency, ready to roll without needing extras strapped on, so to speak.
So yes, if actually getting my ass to the gym and pectoral workouts don’t make my breasts as high as I want them, I’d happily look into this procedure.
I’ve never given much of a damn what the male population thinks. I seek things for my own benefit, and there’s something psychological about needing an external bra that I don’t think would be there if the solution became a part of my body rather than an article of clothing. I’d like to be completely naked and feel that I have everything I need, and what I need includes more breast support than my body provides.
Kyra, you just articulated something I’ve felt for a long time but never been able to put into words. When I put on my industrial-strength bra every morning, it’s the same sort of feeling I often have when I take my medications: I’m deficient. I’m reminded of it every day, and there’s nothing I can do about it.
And then I feel guilty for feeling so bad about such relatively small things, since I am incredibly privileged in pretty much every other respect.
I feel exactly the opposite! I’d worry a lot that putting stuff in would trigger some sort of bad immune response. I know that’s never been proven about breast implants, but it’s a theory, and that’s enough for me. I’m not putting anything extra into my body unless there’s a really, really good reason for it to be there.
I have enormous boobs, and I’m not really comfortable without a bra. But I’d much prefer for people to put more effort into developing better bras than for them to research creepy invasive surgeries. Actually, right now I’d settle for stores just stocking my bra size, which would be some sort of miracle.
I have seriously considered reductions, though.
Sally, I’d also be first in line if I could have Google implanted in my brain. So there are matters of personal preference at play here.
bonsai, why would they consider the fact that women are active? You know sports are for boys!
Seriously, though, my initial, visceral reaction is one of horror.
Okay, no one else has said this, so I just have to: The idea is udderly horrifying.
Sorry, I just had to!
*scampers out*
This kind of reminds me of the debate surrounding using the pill to suppress your period, with some women feeling it was unnatural and shaming of menstruation, and others (myself in this camp) feeling it would liberate then from unneccessary pain and inconvienience. And then everyone is amazed at the reactions of the other people – how could they possibly feel that way?
I’getve seen this a lot amongst fellow feminists – the tendency to universalize one’s own experience. (Another debate along those lines – You only wear skirts to get patriarchal approval, vs. No, they’re really more comfortable than pants for my body shape.)
I can empathize with not feeling the need to get surgically altered, but for me this kind of runs along the same lines as being able to get rid of my glasses with laser eye surgery.
(That is, setting aside the issues of whether or not the interno-bra actually works, whether it’s safe, etc.)
This is cool in theory, but I am honestly concerned about breaking my ribs if each breast was hanging by two cables. That’s potentially a lot of force over a very small area if I make sudden movements.
Then again, I am probably not the target audience for this surgery.
Me no spell so good – hope my post was coherent enough.
Cohen, the CEO of the company offering this product, says, “The aesthetic market is growing rapidly; most women are willing to try things out – it’s becoming like a trend.” And the article says,
So I agree with commentors above who are thinking this isn’t something to help out women with large breasts.
I’m disturbed by the growing trend to surgically alter our physical appearance for purely aesthetic reasons and think this is not only a feminists issue since men get hair implants, tummy tucks, face lifts, etc. The frequency with which the procedures are done is increasing and the age at which people want them is decreasing. (Women getting breast implants at 18 as a graduation present. My niece — a young, married mom — got them between having her two kids.)
I don’t know — I’d just like to live in a more civilized and less superficial society. Is it just another form of competition? “I don’t want to lose in the looks-game”?
Vanessa are you refering to the laser correction that restores perfect vision for a rather cheap $1500 then having to deal with those horrible marks on your nose from wearing glasses. Or even worse if you have to read and drive and got really bad eyesight in general?
See, I’m for it. People who are at the extremes do tend to view these kind of things are unnecessary, but it is a major relief at the same time for those who seek it. Why would I rather wear thick coke bottle glasses that hide my face and beauty, use a different pair for reading and a different one for driving, and one for casual? The glasses themselves with that new shaping to allow for both on one set of glasses were a major improvement, but expensive. For a permanent fix I’d take the surgery on my eyes or anything else.
Besides it would be a lot better for active girls with rather large mammaries. Instead of having to use tight constricting wonderbras and the rest you can use this for an extra layer of protection and cut down on discomfort. A uplifting cushion that doesn’t constrict.
The idea is very nice, but then again you probably would want a nice loose bra or a sweater when wearing lighter shirts in summer. I’m for it for those that want it. Patriarchy approved or not anything that is comfortable and enhances my self esteem and self image; its a perfect win.
I could take a walk down to Bel Air west gate at Sunset and Bellagio and not be embarrassed by those snobs or gawked at by the men. Just cause my origins have a little more plump in them, as do all negro girls why should I be uncomfortable walking down the street. The days of the F bra are over for me once I get that surgery! Might be lucky to squeeze into a D cup, but I’d walk up and down those streets every day Holmby Hills like a princess and no man gonna make me feel bad about these babies.
wtf. i feel like a total weirdo as i have very large breasts (dd – dddish) and i despise wearing a bra. i wear it out of the house, as otherwise i get the extra friendly nipples and i dont dig that, but the minute i walk in my door i tear the thing off. i much prefer my breasts swinging free, and always have. i kno everyone is different, but i was surprised to not see anyone else with an experience like my own. i hate bras. then again, maybe my experience is different since i have terrible posture and mild scoliosis, i dont ever sit up straight, if i did, i imagine a bra might be rather nice.
I think it’s a terrible idea. If people don’t want to wear bras, then don’t wear bras. There’s no reason to surgically implant a bra. Would a dude want an internal jock strap that twisted his penis into a permanently clothes-fitting position? There is no reason on earth for an implanted bra.
*choke*
I’m astonished at the sheer number of women here – on Feministe of all places – who seem to think that this device is being constructed in order to help women who experience physical discomfort from their breasts.
This is designed to “treat” the fabricated disease of “breast ptosis”, which is a result of being a female human dwelling in Earth gravity.
It’s being tested on pigs, who I hardly think are being carefully asked to rate breast discomfort scales while walking, jogging or playing tennis.
And there is no reason at all why implanting a plastic device into your body that suspends you breast from fascia at a slightly higher than normal location will be any more comfortable than your natural breast being suspended from its fascia at a normal location. And plenty of reason to think the exact opposite, since this device is more likely than human tissue to shift, create tissue reaction, or get infected.
The cancer detection issue is another huge one, as is breastfeeding, since they’re aiming this at teenagers as well as adult women. On what fucking PLANET do teenagers get “breast ptosis”?
This is a feminist blog? Or does the permanent implantation of a surgical “e” make you blind to – erm, basic problems feminists might have with this *wondrous innovation*?
There is nothing okay about this. When I don’t want to wear a bra, I don’t wear one. This is disturbing.
The thing is, this isn’t being designed as a replacement for breast reduction – it’s a replacement for a standard breast lift, and its main purpose to restore perkiness, essentially, which is not so much about a woman’s comfort. I took a rather light approach to it in my post, but I’m really disturbed by the idea that this is just some easy breezy replacement for a bra. It may work like one, but it’s still cosmetic surgery.
…do …do they make those? Maybe not one that twists the penis all up, but something that keeps the testicles from being all bouncy when you don’t want them to?
As someone who has already had elective body-modification surgery once (Lasik), I’m always fascinated by those people who suggest that the only possible reason we would do these things would be for the benefit of others. I am all for surgery that lets us have control of things about our bodies we don’t like, for whatever reason we may feel we want it.
Huh? The aesthetic market is growing rapidly; most women are willing to try things out – it’s becoming like a trend.
I hear people’s concerns about existing bra options, but this isn’t being marketted as an alternate to breast reduction for women with breast related upper body pain etc. It’s an alternative to breast lifts aka still the pursuit of beauty myth perkiness.
Bra’s are a hassle, but so is invasive surgery and normalising the idea that one should cut for beauty.
This bra may increase women’s choices for better or worse, but does anyone consider whether it is ethical to test invasive survery (and cosmetics for that matter) on highly intelligent, social and sensitive animals? This is not life-saving research, it’s simply a matter of aesthetics and/or convenience so in my opinion the end does not justify the means.
ouch! ouch ouch ouch ouch ouch. i’m getting sympathy pains here, and i’m male.
also, with regard to the athletic points made, this doesn’t seem like it would go with the shooting sports either. that support wire looks like it would end up right underneath where a long gun’s stock is supposed to rest, and recoil can be bad enough as it is.
To me it looks like a surgical solution to something that can be solved with better posture. It would be impractical for a larger breasted woman where breast reduction would be the better option. It seems to be designed for the ‘keep them perky’ mentality and if we taught girls to pull their shoulders back and keep their chins up, we wouldn’t need to put them under the knife. Yet if your dream for your life is to do nothing but go from your receptionist desk to a bar stool at night, it would be one less item of clothing that needed to be laundered.
OUCH. Call me crazy, but I don’t want parts of my body cut open unless its a life or death situation. Sure bras are uncomfortable and expensive. Sure I have to spend an extra 15 minutes at the gym strengthening my back/pectorals to carry them…but come on people. This is surgery. There are needles and other sharp, pointy objects near your breasts. I don’t know about you, but I don’t want any sharp pointy objects near my breasts unless its a last resort. I’ve grown excessively fond of them over the years.
I have to echo Ouch, Ouch, Ouch, Ouch, but I’m a woman with DDs that careened up to Js (I kid you not) after the birth of little Nigel Jr. Boobies change shape and size for some of us pretty wildly. Bras are much easier to replace.
Just my 2 cents.
D-cups, active lifestyle, and I have a solid upper body workout, including pecs. Also, have elevated breast cancer risk. All of which means that anything that gets in the way of health maintenance, cancer screening and the possiblity of mastectomy with minimal complications is right out.
It’s nice to have an alternative to life threatening implants, but the base issue of whether breasts need to be a certain shape/size/consistency/symmetry in order to be pleasing is strange. There are as many appreciators of breasts as there are breasts, and all of them, whether male or female, have different preferences. I think it’s ultimately the differences, the shifts off normal/baseline that make us complex, unique, memorable people…but that’s my esthetic and value set.
Being a male who will likely not need any bra or such surgery, I only see this as one more option for a woman to consider regarding her own, personal situation. I do not think this will be very popular, but I do not think either it will turn out to be non-useful. If it turns out to be easily removable (a reversal of the implantation technique), I think it will be more attractive. If a woman feels it is not too invasive, and if she feels its side effects (once learning about them from her doctors) are acceptable, then this is her judgment call. I feel that more options give more power.
I’m not sure that I see the difference between “increasing perkiness” and bra-replacement. We only have a diagram and an overly-enthusiastic news article to judge this thing by, so we can only theorize about the nuts and bolts effects – like what happens if breast size changes, or whether it would cause discomfort. Even if this particular execution doesn’t end up working out, I think it’s a promising idea for those of us who think of their bodies as somewhat modular, and don’t like bralessness.
Does anyone have ideas to improve upon what they show here?
i thought of a different angle: if this is shown to be a useful option that’s safer/cheaper than reduction for the large of boob, it could possibly eventually be covered by insurance similarly to reductions for medical needs are now. (which is to say, not much, but even a little is better than nothing.) stopping the back pain through a covered procedure once, vs. out-of-pocket equipment you have to put on every day and constantly be adjusting, replacing, concealing – i can see the appeal. (ftr, i’m a hard-to-fit 32F.)
seems like the more effective thing (if it was really for pain control) would be to come up with some way of shoring up the original ligaments.
philosophizer, there is no chance in hell that this would be a “once-off” procedure. No body implant procedure is. Body size and shape changes, wear happens, implants encapsulate, shift, erode through soft tissue and bones.
*shudder* That picture makes me want to hug my boobies and run far, far away.
But then, I’m needle/knife/pain phobic.
it’s almost as ‘once’ as a reduction, especially in comparison with bras. that’s all i meant.
All things considered, the graphic appears to have been drawn by an artist for the magazine – as a scientist I can safely say we do not do the whole ‘artistic rendition’ thing any more as it often leads to errors or imprecision, so I would not rely on this image to see how the thing would work – especially as modern implants of any kind, cosmetic or not, have far more organic shapes than that crude cupped shelf in the image to prevent internal stress.
In terms of attachment, (this is the biggest cause for suspicion as to the origin of the image) there are actually ready-made pathways for the connectors with no risk of causing muscle damage in the form of the ligaments which originally held the breast in a ‘perky’ position (I forget the technical term; sorry but my speciality is not human biology). The sag comes because over time these ligaments stretch, as the tissues in them age much like skin becomes less elastic. This would essentially replace their function with something immune to age related tissue degradation, rather than creating an entirely unnatural effect (I know that the notion of there being one standard breast shape is both sexist and wrong, however the fact is there is a component of the female biology with no function besides making the breasts perky, and denying this does no-one any favours. Breast potosis is simply an age related degenerative problem, much like the increased fragility/slowed healing of the skin, and as for it resulting simply from residing in the earth’s gravitational field, cancer is contributed to by the natural background radiation of the ground, and by our very own metabolic processes. Just because it happens anyway with time from natural sources doesn’t mean it is an explicitly good or bad thing).
The fact that this would be replacing/adding to a ligament structure also means that the phenomena experienced with normal implants – which are unanchored – of ‘drifting’ in the breast tissue would not occur, just like plates attached to damaged bones connot ‘wander’ because they are actually directly attached to an actual supportive structure.
With respect to the tendency to change shape, modern polymers are quite elastically stable, far beyond biological ligaments. They could easily provide a reaction force proportionate to gravity (which is the objective of such a ligament replacement/augmentation) even after the mass of tissue and size of breast alters considerably – in other words, it would not become too tight or too slack unless there was an incredibly extreme change of shape and mass (we are talking a change in the linear dimensions of the breast of close to 50% here, not just putting on a few inches around the bustline).
As for cancer detection, it is important to note that while the observational test is very valuable, this is more because it costs nearly nothing to implement – its detection rate is dire (I believe around 50%) but it is so fast, cheap and easy it would be foolish not to do it as standard just in case. Besides, with the continual drop in the costs of MRI it is becoming increasingly favourable to use this technique (with more than 90% detection rate at earlier stage cancer) instead, and it is unaffected by such things as implants.
If you wish to get specific about the risk of lymphomas, it should also be considered that if the lymph fluid stops moving, risk increases. In the breast there are no muscles to squeeze the lymph around and instead incoming lymph (which has no real pressure gradient to push with) and predominantly gravity must do the job of moving it in the breast – and if any of the breast sags below the connection to the torso gravity will have a mighty fine time trying to push the stuff uphill to prevent it from ‘pooling’ while standing up.
Nenhume: The main difference between “breasts ptosis” and cancer or skin fragility is that cancer and skin fragility are actual problems.
I’m not sure why you’re rebutting assertions that implants would change shape or drift due to being unanchored, since those assertions haven’t been made in this thread (unless I missed something). Where are you getting that “the breast must change in linear dimensions by 50% before there would be any noticeable alteration in fit” figure from? These implants, as far as I can see, have never even been put into a human. Do you have access to some data we don’t?
Cancer detection is more than mammography: most are detected by touch. I think it’s very reasonable to suggest that the presence of a physical implant between skin and glandular tissue, with potentially the addition of scar tissue, is likely to impair that process.
I’ve no idea what you’re talking about with the lymphoma speculation. Are you seriously saying that women with lower breasts are more susceptible to lymphoma? Do you have a cite?
That picture disturbs me. The entire concept disturbs me. I would rather a cure for breast cancer than an internal bra/another way to modify our bodies.
*hugs her Maidenform and runs far away*
Ummm….no.
And the fact that they’re testing it on pigs upsets me even more. I’d rather just let them sag a little.
As someone who had a knee ligament replaced last year, I have to laugh at the people thinking that this would be a quick-n-easy solution to not having to wear a bra. I had endoscopic surgery and I was on heavy-duty pain medications for two weeks and couldn’t work for three weeks. Even for a “regular” breast implant surgery, you’re off work and on bed rest for a week at a minimum, and this looks a lot more invasive than shoving a pillow of silicone into your breast.
Not to mention that having your natural DDDs or Fs hoisted up to your chin will end up looking a little … weird.
Xana: to be fair, curing breast cancer would modify the way breasts normally are, too. And it’s not like it’s an either/or proposition. I’d rather have a cure for cancer too, but that’s not what’s sitting in front of us.
I do think I have a problem with testing cosmetic/convenience surgery on animals, though, now that people have brought it up. It adds a whole new dimension to the ethical problems associated with plastic surgery.
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All the people saying “If you don’t want to wear a bra, don’t wear one” like it really solves anything are beginning to remind me of the pro-lifers who object to contraception with “if you don’t want a baby, don’t have sex.”
Such a solution would be perfect if wearing a bra was the whole of the problem, but as it stands it overlooks the various problems that lead us to wear bras in the first place. If a woman finds bras annoying, but still wears them, there’s obviously something about going braless that’s worse than the bra, and saying “just don’t wear it” simply removes the lesser annoyance and leaves one stuck with the greater one.
I have been wishing for years that someone would come up with a way to re-tighten or replace the ligaments that hold up the breasts. Their (yes, normal in earth-gravity) stretching due to gravity and bouncing makes me all kinds of squeamish and I wish they’d stay in their original position after being bounced around. And I wish the bouncing didn’t hurt. And I wish I didn’t have to put something ON my body to prevent them from bouncing and swinging.
Why would someone want to put a bra IN their body? Because what’s IN your body is less conspicuous, including to yourself, than what’s on it. I switched from glasses to contact lenses as soon as I could because they are so inconspicuous compared to glasses—I don’t see them, I don’t feel them, they don’t get between me and the world. They become, to me, a part of me, rather than an annoying appliance that’s on me.
This bra-thing I see the same way—it would be under my skin, and accepted/welcome by me; I would see it as a part of me, rather than something inconveniently added that I had to wear to get the benefits from, much like a broken bone can sometimes be fixed by a few screws rather than dealing with a cast for six weeks.
Obviously there are people who think otherwise, people who are horrified by it even—but as certain people have pointed out, this is a feminist community, and I am surprised to see people vilify this thing out of hand with so little consideration for those of us who feel that such a thing could be useful or helpful to us. This is an individual sort of procedure, not a policy that we must all embrace or reject as one. No one’s going to be forced to get it; none of you will profit any by wishing it unavailable to me or others who’d consider it.
Yeah, it is in some ways a tool of the patriarchy. So is giving birth. But we sometimes have more pressing concerns than what the patriarchy approves of. Personally, I’m not going to ignore my own comfort to spite anyone.
Like breast implants, I don’t think this buys you perfect breasts forever. Implants are famous for requiring repeat surgeries as the body changes and/or the devices fail in some way.
I think this thing would cause problems with breastfeeding, maybe making mastitis more of an issue.
Any breast surgery is going to cause scars, and I can’t figure out what the scar line is going to look like with this. Also, any breast surgery can cause loss of nipple sensation due to nerve damage.
I also think that if you have this done when you are young, that inevitable changes from weight gains/losses, pregnancy, lactation, and just plain gravity may keep the breast tissue suspended, but may not keep nipples in the same place they started. Which is just going to lead to more surgery if you can’t handle that.
I personally am very down on most elective surgeries for one reason: American hospitals just aren’t that good at controlling hospital staph (MRSA) infections from spreading. While it’s true that it’s mostly the very young and the very old who will die from one of these superbugs, any person can be very disfigured by surgeries required to remove infected tissues once one of these infections gets rolling.
Nail. Head. Bang.
When I was a punk-rock teenager with lots of safety-pin piercings and tattoos, I used to get plenty of shocked and appalled comments along the lines of “You’ve mutilated yourself!” and “How could you cut up your body just to fit in to a crowd!” Which has always made me eyeroll when people refer things as mutilation.
You know, I’d never get this surgery as it’s probably expensive and not covered by insurance, and I don’t really have the time to sit around and recover right now. Also, the execution of this particular design seems lacking. (What do they do with the extra skin? It just seems like if the interior is lifted but not the exterior, then there’d be some extra skin that would kind of hang there all deflated and weird.)
But the concept of an interno-bra? Seems fine to me (and less invasive than a breast lift – which, in my limited experience, is done at the same time when you get a reduction. At least, it was to my friend who got a reduction). Given infinite money and leisure time, I’d consider it. I certainly wouldn’t be any more or less reluctant to go through the recovery period than I was to wait for my piercings or tattoos to heal.
Am I the only person disturbed by the fact that there seem to be a lot of people whose primary objection is not that this is something being developed for human women, but that it is being tested on animals?
Don’t get me wrong, I’m against unnecessary animal testing too, and so I’m not thrilled by the idea of some poor pig stuck with this thing in its chest.
But for that to be your primary objection? Seriously?
And for the record, this is so far removed from LASIK I’m astonished it needs to be spelled out: LASIK exists to surgically correct an actual /flaw/ in someone’s eyes. The eye is shaped in such a way that the person /cannot/ see properly. The eye is failing to do what it is designed to do. LASIK, just like glasses and contact lenses, corrects that problem.
Saggy breasts – I’m sorry, “breast ptosis”, in no way impairs the function of breasts. Saggy breasts lactate as well as perky breasts, they experience sensation (i.e. erogenous zone-y goodness) as well as perky breasts.
If a woman’s breasts are impairing the functions of other parts of her body (i.e. causing back pain due to large size, preventing her from exercising, threatening the life of the rest of the body due to cancer), then surgical techniques make sense as corrective measures. But as has already been made pretty clear, this device (shudder!) does not seem to have been developed with large-breasted women nor female athletes in mind. Meaning the only thing it will help us do is look better or fit better into mass-produced clothes. The proportions of which are by-and-large still dictated by men.
Well, technically the “quick and easy fix” is the removal of the need to wear bras for an indefinite but presumably long-term period of time. Compared with years of bra shopping, bouncing, swinging, self-consciousness and wishing that your chest looked better when you’re naked, there’s many people who would rather have that three weeks of recovery with a good chance of getting rid of all or most of that.
Obviously more research would be indicated before anyone takes my word for this, but it looks to me like it’s a lot less invasive than the implants. It seems to be able to fit in using a small slit and perhaps a couple tiny incisions, plus bone screws like in bone repair, unlike the wide gash needed to fit in a silicon bubble.
As for it not being made with athleticism or support in mind, the airplane that flew at Kitty Hawk was neither an F-22 nor a passenger liner, it was a first attempt. If the basic design is good, it can be modified to other specializations.
Oh the heck with it, let’s just get ourselves out of the gravity well altogether.
I’d be MUCH happier with that than implantable bras.
That just means it’s cosmetic rather than medically necessary. The LASIK analogy had to do with explaining why internal, surgical solutions could be preferred by some people to external ones.
So? There’s more to breasts than lactating ability. Menstrual cramps might not interfere with fertility, but people tend to want to get rid of them anyway. This thing has the potential to alter how they sit there, as an alternative to an external bra, which the people attached to the breasts might like to have some increased say in.
And what, nobody can alter the design a bit for one of the purposes you approve of? Or use it as is? Who knows how much downward force the thing is built to absorb, or can be built to absorb. Breast implants come in all sorts of sizes and shapes to suit the wishes of the person getting them and I would be very surprised if these things weren’t the same—customizable or a wide selection so the amount of lift and the springiness can be chosen.
And I don’t care if beauty is largely dictated by men. I don’t care if my ideas of beauty sometimes coincide with theirs. Rather than trying to go against their dictates, and rejecting everything they like, I try to ignore their dictates, and do what pleases me. And if it pleases me to have perky breasts that don’t bounce, don’t stretch their original tendons, and don’t require external support to feel comfortable, and it pleases me enough to justify a certain amount of surgery, then I will get it—and how many men it happens to please as a side effect is simply not worthy of consideration.
Would there be an upper limit on this sort of thing?
As an FF I cannot CANNOT go without a bra- aside from the whole “saggy boobs at 23yo OMGNO Teh Patriarchy is DISPLEASED” there is the thing about back pain, chest pain, uncomfortable wobbliness whenever I try to move at anything above a gentle stroll, inability to sleep on my back unless I’m wearing what I think of as a night-bra…
So this would seem, in theory, to be great for me- then I would only need a bra for when I WANT to wear one, and I could probably be more creative in the way I dress and be more comfortable on hot days…
But, considering the discomfort that the weight of my breasts has on my chest as a whole, when thinking long-term, what sort of deformation or damage could this do the the rib that my breasts would be suspended from?
Also, yeah, how does this react to/effect changes in breast size, cancer detection, the feel of the breast, etc?
Bunny Mazonas:
Just from what I read from the original article, how much of this Cup&Up thing will deal with those issues? My understanding is that it’s kind of like an internal under-the-breast platform, which means the weight will still be there (so pains and wobbliness would still be there). Also, if it’s a platform for underneath… wouldn’t that not do a whole lot, with regards to sleeping on your back?
I note that I am a C-cup, and thus am clueless as to the trials of having a larger cup-size. Alls I deal with are boob sweat (yick), flopping about, and shirtlessness-envy.
Are you guys kidding?
You need to change your blog name to ‘…e’, because it’s the only letter in ‘feministe’ that isn’t false advertising.
Reasons I need a bra:
1. Turn the headlights off. (I don’t see, in theory, why nipples should be so offensive, but there you have it.)
2. Protection. I have increased sensitivity, especially in the nipple (the slightest brush can give me an hour of pain), and I actually can’t wear a top without a bra because of it. A bra gives me protection from the bumps and brushes that come with having breasts, keeping me from experiencing more pain than I have to. I used to wear a bra 24/7 except to shower (even to sleep) — now I’m a bit freer to go nekkie, but when I’m clothed, the bra’s gotta be on.
As I see it, this addresses neither of those concerns — so it’d be useless for me.
I can see why it would be useful for some people — everyone faces a different situation, and though “breast ptosis” is not a medical problem and should not be as aesthetically offensive as our society seems to consider it, it can be rather uncomfortable. If this surgery solves some major discomfort on the part of some women, with overall positive effect, then I’m all for it.
However, that’s not what the surgery seems to be sold on. It’s being sold to make your ugly dirty droopy breasts prettier and perkier. Which, as rightly pointed out, is bullshit.
That’s what people are objecting to, I think — not the existence of the surgery so much as the stated purpose.
Really, I think what’s so offensive about it is that it frames breast droopage as unnatural, disordered, wrong. A problem to be surgically corrected, if you are so privileged as to be able to afford it.
This is clearly wrong. If you own a pair of breasts, chances are over the years, they’re going to start to droop. Hell, the same is true of any other sac of fat on your body (owned for a similar length of time). It happens. It is natural. It is normal.
Well, I can see just fine if I slap on a pair of glasses. But guys don’t make passes at girls who wear glasses, so I’m willing to bet that a good portion of people, or even of women, who get LASIK do so because they don’t want to look all nerdy in their glasses anymore. So they get an invasive, risky (well, riskier than slapping on a pair of glasses every morning), expensive procedure in order to comply with beauty standards.
So the analogy seems pretty apt to me.
Frankly, I would never get LASIK. For one, I have a weird things-touching-my-eyeball phobia. But second, I’ve worn glasses since I was seven years old, and they’re part of my identity – I’d feel like I shaved off my eyebrows or something. But I’d never tell a woman she shouldn’t get rid of the old coke-bottles if she felt the need (or, for that matter, if she felt the need to shave off her eyebrows).
Er, no.. Just. No. I don’t think it would be wise to advance something that is definitely going to hurt your ribcage. That’s the thing that protects your heart? Your breasts just HAPPEN to be in front of it.
**shiver**
However, if someone else would derive happiness from such a surgery, great.
I agree though that this is not being pushed as a “health” surgery but as a way to tell you that your normal breasts, are ugly. My boobs are no one’s business but my own tyvm. And I don’t aprieciate being told that they are “unnatural” and the whole testing with pigs. Poor things, leave them for the important research, such as a cure for breast cancer.
I’m still not getting how what the patriarchy wants and what the patriarchy would push this development for is particularly relevant to those of us who know better than to listen to them.
I doubt that anyone here is much inclined to get the thing solely for guys to have a more pleasing time viewing her tits. If any of us will be arsed to have a surgical procedure done, we’ll have reasons for it that are significant to us.
Everybody who’s complaining about how it’s marketed—great. Wonderful. Very complaint-worthy. But please stop with the assertions and insinuations that because the society we live in sees and sings the praises of the aesthetic benefits to men, it cannot possibly be of any use to those of us who could use a lift for other reasons.
That large numbers of other women seem to think that they need male approval like they need oxygen is a problem in itself that transcends the various means they’ll use to get it. Attack that. Attack potential health issues—everybody who’s talking about the strain on the ribs, good call (although I wonder if breasts aren’t supported by the ribs already, in which case this would simply shorten the length they’re hanging by, with no increase in downward force). Attack the people who are selling this for aesthetic reasons rather than as support. But it appears to fill half the function of a bra—what’s wrong if someone who wears bras for support wants to wear them inside herself instead?
Thorn: Human women get to make the choice of whether or not to have things implanted other the skin. Test animals, do not. I find that concerning.
My knee still hurts more than a year after surgery, partly because of the scar tissue that formed under my one-inch-long incision. Potential of lifelong low-grade pain in exchange for not wearing a bra? Well, I guess women make that decison all the time when they decide to get breast implants, so this isn’t that different. And, yes, drilling into the bone is more invasive than putting a bag of silicone into a bag-shaped organ. Hanging hooks and wires from the ribcage would be a little more invasive than and, to me, have a much greater potential to go wrong than, a breast implant.
It’s very interesting to me how many people here are down on breast implants but think that this device is a wonderful advance for humanity. It does the same thing as implants at a different angle — that’s it.
Breasts in bras don’t fall “naturally,” though, and we pretty much seem to be willing to accept the usage of those. I totally agree that it’s not the end of the world that breasts are subject to gravity like all other objects on Earth. I would never consider a traditional breast lift, for example. It would hurt and cost lots of $ and not really have an effect on my life. This thing seems like it would provide similar support to what a bra provides, though, and I’m wearing a bra right now, after all. The shape is the same as what you’d get with a triangle-top bikini sort of thing, just hidden underneath the skin. I’d posit that would have a very different physical effect on the breasts than putting more mass in the breast with no new support. And as far as I can tell, the Patriarchy approves of my boobs as they are, so that limits my patriarchy-approval-seeking behavior in this regard. Possible effects regarding scar tissue, too much stress on the ribs, we can only really speculate here, and I guess I think it goes without saying that if it turns out to cause even moderate long-term pain or disfigurement, I’m not interested. I’m not going to cry into my DD cups if this turns out to be a no-go.
Reasons I wear a sports bra-
1. It keeps the ladies from swinging on their own at inconvenient times.
2. It moves the strain on the back muscles to a point that I am comfortable with over the day.
3. It wicks sweat out from under the Ds and cools the mass.
I gave up on underwires because they just kept poking me and I only need so many to make a mini greenhouse for my starter plants.
I will never stand in the way of someone who wants to go under the knife to achieve a valued look but I feel that the breast issue is a feminst issue because we have so many weird myths about them. The hard fact is is that we value them not because they are a part of our body and deserve our attention but because others place a value on them that has nothing to do with us. I resented the work my mother put me through to get good posture but when I grew the D cups, I appreciated that I could carry them without strain. My bones aren’t designed to do the work of my back muscles and I am concerned that someone thinks that ribs can be turned into weight-carrying bones. I also think that it is ludicrous that the testing is being done on pigs as they walk on 4 legs and gravity affects their teats differently than ours.
As long as we identify breasts as part of a woman’s identity then breast issues are feminist.
I’m a breast cancer survivor who had a double mastectomy with reconstruction almost a year ago. Since then, I’ve been in constant pain and cannot find a bra that doesn’t hurt to wear, yet it hurts to go without a bra for any period of time due to the weight of my new breasts (which are barely B cups!). Because the whole idea of implanting anything in my body squicked me out, I went with the TRAM flap reconstruction, which moves fat and muscle from my belly up onto my chest. However, after a year of dealing with the pain, I’m a little more open to this idea of an inner bra. I mean, hell, they’ve already gutted me like a fish and completely rearranged my torso. Having this procedure done at the time of reconstruction wouldn’t haven’t increased the invasiveness at all and might have made things far more comfortable for me since surgery. I think that having this technology available for women who have decided on reconstruction after mastectomy could be a good thing.
That said, I now believe that anyone who voluntarily has their perfectly healthy breasts ripped open and implants shoved in there is a tad crazy. This procedure looks like a lot of pain and trouble, too, and if your only reason to do it is to be “perky”, maybe you should reconsider. This shit hurts and will affect your body for the rest of your life. It should not be taken lightly.
If I knew then what I know now, I’d be boobless.
I see what you’re getting at, but I can’t completely agree. Breastfeeding seems awesome, for example. There are ways that women derive sexual pleasure from their breasts that go beyond them simply being admired by their partners. And for that matter, I like it when I’m admired. I also like compliments on my hair.
“Breastfeeding seems awesome, for example. There are ways that women derive sexual pleasure from their breasts that go beyond them simply being admired by their partners.”
Surgical procedures have a tendency to interfere with both non-aesthetic functions of breasts: lactation/breastfeeding and erotic sensation. And surgeons have a tendency to underplay or completely dismiss both of these adverse effects, the former in particular.
Sexual attractiveness and the resulting admiration are a part of the function of the breast but we need to recognize that it can distract us from other issues. Breast health, as with all body parts, is integral to our overall well being and sense of self. They are a part of our sexuality, a part of our ability to move and function and a part of our ability to sustain a life other than our own. A doctor is trying to sell a procedure but only the patient can decide how relevant it is to their life and needs. Before any body altering surgery is done, a woman needs to talk to others about what it all entails- time to heal, risk of loss of sensation, scarring, need for repeat surgeries to adjust the implant et al. The end result of any medical procedure should be to make you healthier not perkier.
Sometimes people deal with lifelong low-grade pain without getting anything in exchange. Some people might think it a nice change of pace for the pain to come alongside actual benefits. And some people might think it’s worth it. Some people, for that matter, deal with lifetime low-grade or not-so-low-grade pain that this thing could alleviate.
Regarding the invasiveness of bone screws, it depends on how one views invasiveness. Personally, I’d find a gaping gash in my boob a whole lot more invasive than a tiny screw in a bone, to say nothing of the loss of sensation that can come with a reduction.
Does your pain from the knee surgery make you wish you hadn’t had the surgery? Or was it worth it? People consider whether it’s worth it for any type of surgery, and if I or any other woman has sufficient problems with their breasts that they’d consider surgery to have done with, the addition of a new procedure with a new effect improves the likelihood that they can have a result they’re happy with. I would never consider implants because they’re bulky inside me—invasive—and feel wrong. I would never consider reductions because they are likely to reduce sensation. I would, however, consider an internal bra because sling, wires, and screws are flat, small things, and it does the particular thing I want, which is to remove strain on those ligaments that hold up the breasts.
I don’t think that the question of what kind of medical research we should conduct is ever just a matter of personal consumer choice. We have limited resources for medical research. Even if this research isn’t receiving government or non-profit funding, it’s using up the time of some of a limited pool of medical researchers who could be studying other things. So it’s not just a matter of whether individual women should be allowed to make the individual choice to get these things implanted. It’s also about the other people who will be denied choices and treatments because breast-perkiness-restoration was given higher priority than whatever condition affects them.
Damn right. ;)
It was worth it because, without it, I would have had increasingly severe knee damage until I was unable to walk and would require a knee replacement. So, yes, considering that it prevented me from being disabled for the rest of my life, it was worth it.
That’s different from wanting a series of wires hooked into my ribcage with bone screws to keep my breasts from drooping. I realize that, to some people, having perky breasts is more important than being able to walk, but hey, everyone’s different, I guess.
And still no one has answered my question: how is this different than breast implants? It’s an invasive surgery that puts your breasts into an unnatural position. The only difference is that this pushes them up with a shelf instead of a bag of silicone.
Presumably the hole required would be much smaller, the scars would be smaller, the recovery time less intensive, and there would be no increase in breast size. (Duh?)
I think a more fair comparison would be to a breast lift, which, in the limited experience I have with a friend of mine who had a reduction and lift, makes a huge keyhole-shaped scar down the front and around the underneath of your breasts, and a flap of pectoral muscle is re-arraigned to do the same thing the little sling does here.
Look, the thing is, no matter what you do, there are going to be women who seek out breast modifying surgery for whatever reason, patriarchy-pleasing or otherwise. So, the possibility of a way to do that in a less (note less, not non) invasive fashion seems to me to be a good thing.
I hear the complaints about animal testing and the way this seems to be marketed, but to gasp and clutch pearls at the thought of women maybe wanting to alter their breasts for reasons you don’t understand is off-putting. (Not to mention – what about the BREASTFEEDING!!!1!!11 as if feeding babies with your boobies were the only reason for them to exist.) I happen to think that *maybe* women who make decisions about their bodies that differ from mine – (and, full disclosure, I did feed a baby with my boobies) aren’t all poor, confused, addle-pated slaves of the patriarchy.
(end probably overstated rant)
Research resources are not as fungible as you think they are. This is a perfectly reasonable thing for a biomedical engineer and a plastic surgeon to collaborate on; it’s a novel surgical application, and the only other things I can think of that would use their skillset are other medical implants (and I don’t mean breast Implants, I mean things like artificial hips, etc).
– ACS
It is different because you have to slice an opening under the breast tissue to slide the shelf in and then you have to thread a pair of wires through your muscles to pin them into your rib higher up. You now have a rib that is meant to bend inwards to protect the chest cavity being strained outwards to support the variable weight of your breast. Sounds like loads of fun to me but to each their own.
Oh, and it isn’t pushing them up, it is definitely pulling them up.
um…no, not really, it isn’t like that. “if you don’t want to wear a bra, don’t wear one” is more like saying “if you don’t want to have sex, don’t have sex.”
I wouldn’t want surgery, but I somewhat wistfully miss the position my breasts were in for a whole six months… the time between when my body settled on me being a DD cup and the time they sagged, at the ripe old age of eighteen.
I wear a bra most of the time because it keeps sensitive tissues from getting pinched when I do active things with my arms, because it keeps me from getting horrendous skin problems in the area on my torso where they rest, and because it redistributes the weight.
XtinaS
Well, the sleeping-on-my-back thing won’t go away with one of these things, but the back/chest pain and the extreme wobbliness are both reduced a lot by wearing a good-quality, well-fitting bra. The problem is that bras, of course, carry their own discomfort and I can’t wear them all the time.
Then again, now that I think about it, bras stop back/chest pain by moving the focus of the weight to a different area, so that the band around the chest provides most of the support… but this thing would still mean my breasts would be suspended off of the front of my chest, so maybe the pain would still be there…
Ummm… so I’m not so sure what positive benefits it would have… If all this thing does is make us look permanently perky I’m not sure I’d see the point in going through with it…
I guess the problem is that it is unclear how this is going to deal with anything other than sag. Will it prevent pain? Will it deform the ribcage? Will breasts look odd and lumpy if they get bigger after having this thing implanted? (Think of putting on a bra 2 cup sizes too small). And I agree with other commenters that testing this on pigs is a dumb idea in terms of realism, but I don’t see what better alternative there is until these items reach the human testing stage.
Maybe they have the pigs sitting up all the time?
Really! I mean, I always knew that wearing an ill-fitting bra sucks in a lot of ways, but I didn’t know that back pain can be reduced by wearing a good bra. Huh.
(Tone there should be “I really seriously did not know that, being a C-cup and all”. Thank you for filling me in!)
My next worry would be as Hawise mentioned above, having breast weight suspended from the ribcage, which is designed to go inwards. And then I wonder about things like CPR, and what the swaying nature of larger breasts will do to the cables/screws, which leads to me being torn between wanting to research breast implants/surgical bone screws and wanting to run screaming in the other direction. *guh*
It’s gonna be hilarious in about fifty years when half of all elderly women have the breasts and unlined foreheads of nineteen year olds, but everything else on them has aged.
Nicole your wrong…they have treatments for skin and everything else. It will follow just as these measures do now. 40 is the new 30, by then the 60s will be the new 45.
Well, it’s official. I Blame the Patriarchy and Twisty’s fabulous patriarchy take-downs have ruined me for other feminist blogs.
Seriously folks, the dudely folk inventing and testing this technology absolutely 100% do *not* have your breast comfort in mind when they’re doing so. I promise you that their intentions have everything to do with the same old bs about the aesthetic expectations that women must to live up to in order to get the only appreciation we’re accorded in a patriarchal society.
In fact, I’ve just read through the article again to be sure and absolutely nowhere in there do they speak to the issues of back pain or large breasts. It’s aesthetic through and through and they never say otherwise.
Yet how many of the women responding here are concerned with back pain and issues related to having large breasts? If this is such a huge concern for us, as women, how come it doesn’t rate even a one-sentence mention in this article? If sensitivity post-surgery is such an important thing that it gets mentioned over and over here, why doesn’t it rate a mention as a potential benefit of this procedure over more invasive surgeries (from reading the article it’s hard to say if this would be a benefit, but that seems to be speculation here)?
Women’s comfort is not what they’re concerned with. Women’s health is not what they’re concerned with. Women’s sexual pleasure and enjoyment of their own bodies is *not* what they’re concerned with. Their concern is that women maintain patriarchy-approved attractiveness in the form of perky breasts, breasts that defy gravity and look bouncy and full and “young” long after that would be practical in reality.
Yes. It is.
I added a bit to my post Snoopy-Nosed Redundant Skin Envelopes after researching the faux-disease of breast ptosis. Writeups are even arranged carefully into Prevalence, (A)etiology, Pathophysiology, and Clinical Findings, and include this little gem: “Etiology is varied and can be due to several components but gravity seems to be a common factor.”
Someone gets paid for this shit.
My thoughts on whether this is at all necessary are probably beside the point, since I have small breasts and I’ve never really needed bras for comfort or support anyway. I’ll let people who would stand to gain or lose from this cover those angles.
But I do have to say that the diagram and description just have a way of making me worry. Breasts are heavy, wiggly, stretchy things (bless their hearts) and I have a hard time imagining any material for those tiny suspensory wires that could stretch enough to acommodate all that breast movement and still be firm enough to actually provide support. Ligaments are pretty fragile-looking things and they manage it, but, after all, they’re elastic enough to let the boobs flop around freely and that’s the whole reason this is being invented in the first place.
The fellows developing this cup may not be on my side when it comes to the reasons for it, but I wouldn’t give a damn.
I’m losing weight….a lot of it. And once I reach my goal, a breast reduction and lift are going to be mandatory because there simply IS NO BRA that is going to keep these sagging, now-flat wallets that I can almost fold back over themselves in place. Plus, bacteria LOVES me and my sweat, and I have to duck into the bathroom at least every three hours to wash and reapply the only powder I’ve found that works day after day after day without irritation–non-talc vaginal powder. They tell you if you have stinky feet to wear ventilated shoes and to pack extra socks? I take a washcloth and an extra bra to work! Yes, I now throw away bras because they’ve become too large for me, but at one time I was throwing them away because there was no way to get them clean. It is a horrible feeling to put on a “clean” bra and realize before you’ve finished the drive to work that your body heat has activated the smell in the fabric.
I don’t care if it’s the faux-disease of breast ptosis. I don’t care if you think my consideration of such a procedure keeps me from being a feminist. Bite me.
I am very interested about this bra. I have big breast and I want see how it’s this “feministe bra”. I am a romanian women and I read today this news (“feministe bra”) in the romanian papers and I am curious if I can have acces or if I can buy this new bra.
As a 29 yr old married mom of 2..I think it is a great idea! i have a 34d chest and hate to be unsupported by a bra, my breast now rest on my tummy, I wear 2 not 1 but 2 bras to work out/run in. I wear my bra to bed for comfort. So yes to me this would be wonderful, I have been looking into a lift for just over a year now and the thought of them being scarred and having a worse outcome scares my greatly, but something that is minimally invasive that could be just as easily removed. WAY to go Dr. Gur.
Is it REALLY JUST ME? We have such a women hating culture it’s sickening. Women as plastic sex dolls or women as faceless burka zombies, 2 sides OF THE SAME COIN. Essentially women are OBJECTS not people. Why is it that the medical prof. (mainly run by MEN until very recently, ie the past generation) spend so much time and money on messing with the female body? Why can females be pumped full of hormones to regulate offspring (instead of inventing a male pill). Why do women have dangerous, invasive surgery on A MOST SENSITIVE area to look good (whatever that means because it all depends where and when you live really). How come men don’t get penile silicon implants or jockstraps? I mean I prefer my dicks rockhard and large too but hell very few men are PERFECTLY endowed. Last I checked men weren’t going for these procedures in droves, unlike women who are appearantly standing in line to fork over mucho dineros to have their chests sliced open en plastic implanted there.
Does anyone here believe these torture devices were created to make women LOOK better not FEEL better. Sigh. Hell I am starting to believe I’d rather wear a burka, nice contrast to all the stripper wanna be’s I seem to be encountering more and more.
Some things were repeted alot but there were lots of really good points and thoughts. Some great storys to, thank you for sharing. Yes this is a new product and there will be lots of questions asked and alot answered. Hopefully there will be alot of refinements as it goes to =).
I am 31 years old, with no childen and I find it hard to wach my body change and age. Wanting my WHOLE body back to the way it was when I was mentally establishing ‘who
I am’ seems very normal. The body typ I had then goes with my mental pitcher of ‘me’ when I was strongest, invincible and age related pain free. You rember those times? Please tell me you dont want any of that back. Point is that some of us want to recapture what we once where and all that life had to offer us. Not to please the namless masses of men we pass on the street. It may be childish but no one want to feel thier own mortality (much less see it in the mirror).
PS. I cant belive no one spoke up about post (41) “if we taught girls to pull their shoulders back and keep their chins up, we wouldn’t need to put them under the knife. Yet if your dream for your life is to do nothing but go from your receptionist desk to a bar stool at night, it would be one less item of clothing that needed to be laundered.” What? Good posture will stop time and the force of gravity?! Then reducing the women that would get this done to what amounts to low intelligent desperate bar flies? If she said this in my presence I would forcfully remove her from the room. I could be wrong in my interpition of what was said and I hope I am.