<?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Feminism and Super Tuesday</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/</link>
	<description>In defense of the sanctimonious women&#039;s studies set.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 10 Feb 2012 11:34:52 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
	
	<item>
		<title>By: Weekend links at Hoyden About Town</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/#comment-150085</link>
		<dc:creator>Weekend links at Hoyden About Town</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Feb 2008 01:51:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/#comment-150085</guid>
		<description>[...] Bad Day For Sexism Is A Good Day For Women from Feministe by Thomas Framing from Feministe by Jill Feminism and Super Tuesday from Feministe by Jill Oprah Says &#8220;I Am Not a Traitor!&#8221; - Consensus vs. Dissent from [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Bad Day For Sexism Is A Good Day For Women from Feministe by Thomas Framing from Feministe by Jill Feminism and Super Tuesday from Feministe by Jill Oprah Says &#8220;I Am Not a Traitor!&#8221; &#8211; Consensus vs. Dissent from [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Virginia Ray</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/#comment-149849</link>
		<dc:creator>Virginia Ray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2008 20:15:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/#comment-149849</guid>
		<description>my friends sent these links:

http://www.cjr.org/campaign_desk/obamas_energy_equivocations.php

votes database -- see for yourself what they do while they&#039;re &quot;working&quot;
(us over)

http://projects.washingtonpost.com/congress/

http://vote-smart.org/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>my friends sent these links:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.cjr.org/campaign_desk/obamas_energy_equivocations.php" rel="nofollow">http://www.cjr.org/campaign_desk/obamas_energy_equivocations.php</a></p>
<p>votes database &#8212; see for yourself what they do while they&#8217;re &#8220;working&#8221;<br />
(us over)</p>
<p><a href="http://projects.washingtonpost.com/congress/" rel="nofollow">http://projects.washingtonpost.com/congress/</a></p>
<p><a href="http://vote-smart.org/" rel="nofollow">http://vote-smart.org/</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Virginia Ray</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/#comment-149842</link>
		<dc:creator>Virginia Ray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2008 19:49:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/#comment-149842</guid>
		<description>I am sorry for my nastiness but  no one even read what I said I would do - they just made their attack points - I SAID I would do college based on grades available to both childless and child full women alike,  which answers most of the criticism of people who, not having babies, could not get the college benefit.  And resented that despite their grades they had to reproduce to go to college.

But you did not read what i want (and try to work for) you just criticized what I said WI did.  WI is still evolving based on evaluations and community political pressure.  The imperative is to be part of that pressure or shut up.

You know, if it is true that in your states, women did not get child care then where were you?  Privileged women have to change that - you don&#039;t just say benefits based on reproduction are better -- you use the momentum of inevitable social change to get what you can prove is needed - that is called feminist organizing as opposed to leftist organizing which sought to keep benefits tied to reproduction.

That is what was done in WI - IMPERFECTLY - of course - struggle never ends but this current system is better than a benefit system where increases came only when you had another baby.  We are still suffering the effects of that system.  

What do we need to do to improve the current laws? - insist on progressive job training - bust open those electrician, carpenter and plumbing  jobs by demanding that workforce development make APPRENTICESHIP part of the training programs.  

BTW, those of you who are lawyers have a duty to find out how to do this - maybe suing workforce development based on sex discrimination in employment training or failure to implement their mandate or whatever ------find something - then sue the unions and companies for any subsequent failures.

That other woman is correct in saying women have to come into the trades programs and companies in groups.  I think they need their own union for support.  

Also we have to make CLASS the substitute priority in affirmative action programs - POOR Blacks, POOR women and AA in proportion to your family&#039;s income as a priority -- AA, which I fiercely support so don&#039;t start, has to be rethought to put poor people first while still protecting minority rights.

No program is a sacred cow - everything evolves - keep thinking forward always based on what you want for your own life -- what would you need if you did not have money to achieve your career goal or if you were being beaten so you could not learn and had PTSD from the violence - what would you need?  Those are the assistance programs i want to see implemented.  

Hillary is articulating exactly the programs I want to see implemented  She challenge Obama to a series of five debate and he refused every one of them. I think both the Obama and Hill&#039;s supporters should make an issue out of this.  Debates are the bare minimum we should demand as part of electoral reform. 

The Hill&#039;s staff is giving up their paychecks -- they say the &quot;Little&quot; people are contributing to Obama  war chest but i bet it is more like the Oprah&#039;s -- does anyone know where the disclosure of the names and amounts of funders can be located - do those forms say how the funders are registered dem, repub or independent?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am sorry for my nastiness but  no one even read what I said I would do &#8211; they just made their attack points &#8211; I SAID I would do college based on grades available to both childless and child full women alike,  which answers most of the criticism of people who, not having babies, could not get the college benefit.  And resented that despite their grades they had to reproduce to go to college.</p>
<p>But you did not read what i want (and try to work for) you just criticized what I said WI did.  WI is still evolving based on evaluations and community political pressure.  The imperative is to be part of that pressure or shut up.</p>
<p>You know, if it is true that in your states, women did not get child care then where were you?  Privileged women have to change that &#8211; you don&#8217;t just say benefits based on reproduction are better &#8212; you use the momentum of inevitable social change to get what you can prove is needed &#8211; that is called feminist organizing as opposed to leftist organizing which sought to keep benefits tied to reproduction.</p>
<p>That is what was done in WI &#8211; IMPERFECTLY &#8211; of course &#8211; struggle never ends but this current system is better than a benefit system where increases came only when you had another baby.  We are still suffering the effects of that system.  </p>
<p>What do we need to do to improve the current laws? &#8211; insist on progressive job training &#8211; bust open those electrician, carpenter and plumbing  jobs by demanding that workforce development make APPRENTICESHIP part of the training programs.  </p>
<p>BTW, those of you who are lawyers have a duty to find out how to do this &#8211; maybe suing workforce development based on sex discrimination in employment training or failure to implement their mandate or whatever &#8212;&#8212;find something &#8211; then sue the unions and companies for any subsequent failures.</p>
<p>That other woman is correct in saying women have to come into the trades programs and companies in groups.  I think they need their own union for support.  </p>
<p>Also we have to make CLASS the substitute priority in affirmative action programs &#8211; POOR Blacks, POOR women and AA in proportion to your family&#8217;s income as a priority &#8212; AA, which I fiercely support so don&#8217;t start, has to be rethought to put poor people first while still protecting minority rights.</p>
<p>No program is a sacred cow &#8211; everything evolves &#8211; keep thinking forward always based on what you want for your own life &#8212; what would you need if you did not have money to achieve your career goal or if you were being beaten so you could not learn and had PTSD from the violence &#8211; what would you need?  Those are the assistance programs i want to see implemented.  </p>
<p>Hillary is articulating exactly the programs I want to see implemented  She challenge Obama to a series of five debate and he refused every one of them. I think both the Obama and Hill&#8217;s supporters should make an issue out of this.  Debates are the bare minimum we should demand as part of electoral reform. </p>
<p>The Hill&#8217;s staff is giving up their paychecks &#8212; they say the &#8220;Little&#8221; people are contributing to Obama  war chest but i bet it is more like the Oprah&#8217;s &#8212; does anyone know where the disclosure of the names and amounts of funders can be located &#8211; do those forms say how the funders are registered dem, repub or independent?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jill H</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/#comment-149806</link>
		<dc:creator>Jill H</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2008 17:25:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/#comment-149806</guid>
		<description>The hostile talk, biting comments and in your face attitude is not the way to go.  You all are very passionate on your points of view obviously, but sheesh, we&#039;re never going to get anywhere like this.  I&#039;m learning so much from all of you, as I&#039;m sure most people viewing and not participating are, but we&#039;ve got to come at this with a little more civility.  It sort of appears like everyone just wants to prove they&#039;re right instead of how to move forward.  It&#039;s a complex issue with lots of view points, but let&#039;s try to see the common ground and respect what each other brings to the table.  I know, I know, this really sounds like &quot;let&#039;s all just love each other talk&quot;, but the nastiness keeps people out of the conversation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The hostile talk, biting comments and in your face attitude is not the way to go.  You all are very passionate on your points of view obviously, but sheesh, we&#8217;re never going to get anywhere like this.  I&#8217;m learning so much from all of you, as I&#8217;m sure most people viewing and not participating are, but we&#8217;ve got to come at this with a little more civility.  It sort of appears like everyone just wants to prove they&#8217;re right instead of how to move forward.  It&#8217;s a complex issue with lots of view points, but let&#8217;s try to see the common ground and respect what each other brings to the table.  I know, I know, this really sounds like &#8220;let&#8217;s all just love each other talk&#8221;, but the nastiness keeps people out of the conversation.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jill</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/#comment-149737</link>
		<dc:creator>Jill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2008 04:15:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/#comment-149737</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;what the hell you are just fucking queens who want to misunderstand so you can feel superior&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Ha, I almost missed that the first time around. &quot;Fucking queens&quot;? Stay classy, Virginia.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>what the hell you are just fucking queens who want to misunderstand so you can feel superior</p></blockquote>
<p>Ha, I almost missed that the first time around. &#8220;Fucking queens&#8221;? Stay classy, Virginia.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jill</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/#comment-149736</link>
		<dc:creator>Jill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2008 04:14:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/#comment-149736</guid>
		<description>Oh, and I should throw in here that Bill didn&#039;t even really reform it himself; he simply accepted the proposal of a staunch conservative Congressman. This was a right-wing, misogynist, anti-immigrant move from its conception.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, and I should throw in here that Bill didn&#8217;t even really reform it himself; he simply accepted the proposal of a staunch conservative Congressman. This was a right-wing, misogynist, anti-immigrant move from its conception.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: La Lubu</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/#comment-149734</link>
		<dc:creator>La Lubu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2008 04:12:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/#comment-149734</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;Hillary reformed welfare because&lt;/i&gt;

Lemme fix that for ya: Bill deformed welfare because &lt;b&gt;throwing women on welfare under the bus scored him political points with white conservatives, including Republicans&lt;/b&gt;. There. All fixed.

The best preventative measure against long-term poverty is.....(drumroll please)....a college degree. Which is exactly what &lt;i&gt;workfare&lt;/i&gt; took away, the educational stipend that provided the best chance for a woman to get off and stay off of welfare. If you are seriously interested in a better life for women and their families, you will support grants for higher education. Period. Full four-year grants, that have a &lt;i&gt;bachelor&#039;s degree&lt;/i&gt; at the end of them. Associates degrees don&#039;t do the trick. 

Define &quot;fucking queens&quot;. Does that mean we are queens of fucking? In what sense? That we really enjoy it? Are really, truly good at it? Both? That we are regal in our ability to fuck? That people adore, revere, and honor our supreme level of fucking? Or that we exert our regalness fucking everywhere, that we literally drip with fucking queenitude? Enquiring minds want to know.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Hillary reformed welfare because</i></p>
<p>Lemme fix that for ya: Bill deformed welfare because <b>throwing women on welfare under the bus scored him political points with white conservatives, including Republicans</b>. There. All fixed.</p>
<p>The best preventative measure against long-term poverty is&#8230;..(drumroll please)&#8230;.a college degree. Which is exactly what <i>workfare</i> took away, the educational stipend that provided the best chance for a woman to get off and stay off of welfare. If you are seriously interested in a better life for women and their families, you will support grants for higher education. Period. Full four-year grants, that have a <i>bachelor&#8217;s degree</i> at the end of them. Associates degrees don&#8217;t do the trick. </p>
<p>Define &#8220;fucking queens&#8221;. Does that mean we are queens of fucking? In what sense? That we really enjoy it? Are really, truly good at it? Both? That we are regal in our ability to fuck? That people adore, revere, and honor our supreme level of fucking? Or that we exert our regalness fucking everywhere, that we literally drip with fucking queenitude? Enquiring minds want to know.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jill</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/#comment-149723</link>
		<dc:creator>Jill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2008 03:50:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/#comment-149723</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Hillary reformed welfare because it tied benefits to reproduction -and she was right to do so - it had nothing to do with WHY women go on welfare - it has to do with how you get more money when you are on welfare and what “help” the system provided - if your tiny minds cannot get the concept of institutional change that is your lie not mine&lt;/blockquote&gt;

But, see, that&#039;s not true at all. Because, first, Hillary didn&#039;t reform it; she just supported Bill&#039;s policy. And even if that were true, the policy they pushed through didn&#039;t remove the tie between benefits and children. What it did was place a five-year lifetime cap on welfare benefits; require legal immigrants to be in the country for many years and jump through a series of hoops before they could access basic health care; up the working requirement without adding any government-aided childcare; and it allowed states to determine for themselves what kinds of welfare plans the implemented, meaning that women in red states and states hostile to immigrants tended to suffer. 

As far as I can tell, there was absolutely &lt;strong&gt;nothing&lt;/strong&gt; in the bill about cutting the tie between reproduction and welfare. So we aren&#039;t deliberately misunderstanding, nor are we small-minded. You haven&#039;t made your case that the federal act did any good -- even in achieving the goals that you promote.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Hillary reformed welfare because it tied benefits to reproduction -and she was right to do so &#8211; it had nothing to do with WHY women go on welfare &#8211; it has to do with how you get more money when you are on welfare and what “help” the system provided &#8211; if your tiny minds cannot get the concept of institutional change that is your lie not mine</p></blockquote>
<p>But, see, that&#8217;s not true at all. Because, first, Hillary didn&#8217;t reform it; she just supported Bill&#8217;s policy. And even if that were true, the policy they pushed through didn&#8217;t remove the tie between benefits and children. What it did was place a five-year lifetime cap on welfare benefits; require legal immigrants to be in the country for many years and jump through a series of hoops before they could access basic health care; up the working requirement without adding any government-aided childcare; and it allowed states to determine for themselves what kinds of welfare plans the implemented, meaning that women in red states and states hostile to immigrants tended to suffer. </p>
<p>As far as I can tell, there was absolutely <strong>nothing</strong> in the bill about cutting the tie between reproduction and welfare. So we aren&#8217;t deliberately misunderstanding, nor are we small-minded. You haven&#8217;t made your case that the federal act did any good &#8212; even in achieving the goals that you promote.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jill</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/#comment-149719</link>
		<dc:creator>Jill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2008 03:44:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/#comment-149719</guid>
		<description>Uh-oh, the ALL CAPS are coming out...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Uh-oh, the ALL CAPS are coming out&#8230;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Virginia Ray</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/#comment-149717</link>
		<dc:creator>Virginia Ray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2008 03:43:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2008/02/05/feminism-and-super-tuesday/#comment-149717</guid>
		<description>I AM SORRY BUT IT SEEMS YOU DELIBERATELY MISUNDERSTAND TO ATTACK - ARE YOU REALLY BRAIN DEAD TO HOW DESTRUCTIVE THAT SYSTEM WAS?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I AM SORRY BUT IT SEEMS YOU DELIBERATELY MISUNDERSTAND TO ATTACK &#8211; ARE YOU REALLY BRAIN DEAD TO HOW DESTRUCTIVE THAT SYSTEM WAS?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>

<!-- Performance optimized by W3 Total Cache. Learn more: http://www.w3-edge.com/wordpress-plugins/

Minified using disk: basic
Page Caching using disk: basic
Database Caching 16/21 queries in 0.035 seconds using disk: basic

Served from: www.feministe.us @ 2012-02-10 07:09:42 -->
