Comments on: Too Close to “Boy” For My Taste

By: cjl

cjl — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 15:41:05 +0000

I’ll throw my two cents in about the debate. I thought McCain’s response to Oliver’s (the young black guy) question about how the bailout would help ordinary people was particularly weird / patronizing. McCain says at the end of his answer how the bailout will help people like Allen stay in their homes. Allen was the older white man who asked a question right before Oliver. It seemed that McCain just assumed that Oliver didn’t own his won home, and moreover, McCain couldn’t make the jump to thinking that Oliver’s parents or siblings might own homes that they would want to stay in. Instead McCain goes back to someone that he assumes does own his own home (the older white man, Allen) to use as his example of ordinary people who will be helped by the bailout. He really missed an opportunity to connect with an undecided voter there and I think it shows something about how he doesn’t understand the concerns of black voters.

By: Bagelsan

Bagelsan — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 15:12:11 +0000

And the answer directed at the man in the audience, re Freddie/Fannie, was probably supposed to come off as “here, son” but I heard “boy” too. McCain was totally buddy-buddy, we-are-almost-equals to the ex-major on the other side of the room though. That was a pretty extreme contrast… (Of course, there were plenty of other variables besides race, so it’s not an air-tight condemnation or anything.)

By: Bagelsan

Bagelsan — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 15:07:19 +0000

“i honestly don’t understand how a white person can treat a POC in a dehumanizing manner and have it NOT be racist.”

Academically, I guess I’d have to say that if the white person dehumanizes *everybody* that way then it isn’t racist to direct that behavior at a POC. Somehow I don’t think that characterizing McCain as an actual sociopath is really the defense against racism that the GOP is looking for, though. :p

More realistically, I thought it was absolutely racist in context. Like some other people said, McCain wouldn’t direct that kind of language at another white man. Maybe at a woman, or someone much younger, though… But even the latter example would probably just mean he’s an asshole *as well as* a racist, not *instead of*.

By: Ginjoint

Ginjoint — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 02:20:55 +0000

“Too close to ‘boy’” is exactly how I heard that. It made my skin crawl.

By: ThickRedGlasses

ThickRedGlasses — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 00:02:35 +0000

ThickRedGlasses- Not only is it impossible to ever determine someone’s “intent,” talking about intent is absolutely inconsequential to talking about whether or not something was racist. When someone does/says something to me that’s racist, it makes absolutely no difference whether or not they MEANT for it to be racist. Don’t mean to rag on you or anything, but I think it’s important for this conversation to realize “intent” is pretty much a non-factor.

Which is why I said, “There has been a long history of calling African Americans names that are designed to remind them that they are worth less than Whites. If Barack Obama has experienced racism like this before, then it doesn’t really matter what McCain’s intentions were.” If Obama thought it was racist, then it was, independent of McCain’s intentions. If Obama didn’t think it was racist, it still could be depending on McCain’s intentions.

By: Danny

Danny — Thu, 09 Oct 2008 18:59:55 +0000

but I think it’s important for this conversation to realize “intent” is pretty much a non-factor.
I thought I posted this last night but maybe I closed by browser before I hit submit.

I personally don’t dismiss intent when it comes to remarks like that. It’s not the sole factor in how I react to something but I think its worth considering. I’m still not sure if McCain’s intent was racist but there is no doubt his intent was arrogant.

By: MaryC

MaryC — Thu, 09 Oct 2008 14:24:39 +0000

Honestly, I can’t imagine that happening. The idea that McCain would have use the “that one” line against Biden doesn’t square with me. It doesn’t compute. That may be why it computes as racist to me.

Taking it a step further, it’s almost unthinkable that he would refer to Senator Clinton or Governor McCaskill as “that one”. That would (rightfully) ignite a shit-storm the likes of which presidential politics has never seen.

I really have to agree with this. Imagining McCain using “that one” against Biden or Hagel is a really stark difference. Of course Biden and Hagel are, for obvious reasons, not constrained by the potential “angry black man” stereotype and could afford to rip his face off in return.

Biden was asked about this moment by Ann Curry on the Today show. He downplayed its racial significance, and instead turned the moment into a more subtly devastating and wide-ranging assessment of McCain’s character: Biden claimed “Oh, John always gets like that when he’s on the attack and doesn’t really like what he’s doing. He never says it to your face when he’s angry, he turns and grumps at the next person.”

Translation: McCain has always been a pissy little jerk when he’s losing, not just to black people, and that’s what you can expect for the next four years if he wins.

By: Siege

Siege — Thu, 09 Oct 2008 13:24:13 +0000

I fail the internet. I wanted to post this link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fmOUP0U5PNk

By: Siege

Siege — Thu, 09 Oct 2008 13:21:16 +0000

Regardless of whether or not it was racist (ftr, I think it was close enough), it was immensely disrespectful and dismissive.

By: RyanR

RyanR — Thu, 09 Oct 2008 05:44:04 +0000

An interesting way to think about this is to imagine how it would sound if McCain referred to Biden, or Kerry, or Hagel, as “that one”.

Although I think the question of whether Obama took it as racist is more or less moot. I think he took it as something his opponent said and doesn’t matter a damn to him. Barack Obama wouldn’t be where he is today if he hadn’t developed an immunity to race-baiting.