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	<title>Comments on: Asher Roth, Hip Hop, and Rockism, Or Why Doesn&#8217;t My Kid Like Hip Hop?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/05/16/roth-rockism-hip-hop/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/05/16/roth-rockism-hip-hop/</link>
	<description>In defense of the sanctimonious women&#039;s studies set.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 10 Feb 2012 09:13:48 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Adam</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/05/16/roth-rockism-hip-hop/#comment-245934</link>
		<dc:creator>Adam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jun 2009 22:08:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/?p=13451#comment-245934</guid>
		<description>&quot;turns his nose up to most music that is not made by straight white men, and that raises all kinds of questions for me that I don’t know how to handle.&quot;

What the heck? That sounded racist to me. I&#039;m black and I say music has no color. Who cares if he likes mostly white musicians?  The music is important, not the color of the musicans. And the word rockism is a dumbass word. Its music, people have different likes of music, dislikes of music and have the right to express them. I use to listen to Hip-hop/rap. Now I don&#039;t like it. My taste in music have changed. Now I mostly like old rock and blues. I hate it when people make shit bigger than it seems. Oh he doesn&#039;t like rap so hes a racist. Oh he doesn&#039;t like Disco so hes a homophobic. Shut the fuck up with the judgment, and see that people are not going to like the same shit as you. And race doesn&#039;t even exist, move forward from the 19 century. The true defiention of rockism is an opinion about music that doesn&#039;t match up with mine.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;turns his nose up to most music that is not made by straight white men, and that raises all kinds of questions for me that I don’t know how to handle.&#8221;</p>
<p>What the heck? That sounded racist to me. I&#8217;m black and I say music has no color. Who cares if he likes mostly white musicians?  The music is important, not the color of the musicans. And the word rockism is a dumbass word. Its music, people have different likes of music, dislikes of music and have the right to express them. I use to listen to Hip-hop/rap. Now I don&#8217;t like it. My taste in music have changed. Now I mostly like old rock and blues. I hate it when people make shit bigger than it seems. Oh he doesn&#8217;t like rap so hes a racist. Oh he doesn&#8217;t like Disco so hes a homophobic. Shut the fuck up with the judgment, and see that people are not going to like the same shit as you. And race doesn&#8217;t even exist, move forward from the 19 century. The true defiention of rockism is an opinion about music that doesn&#8217;t match up with mine.</p>
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		<title>By: Know your craft</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/05/16/roth-rockism-hip-hop/#comment-243677</link>
		<dc:creator>Know your craft</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 May 2009 23:17:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/?p=13451#comment-243677</guid>
		<description>HipHop needs to evolve more. Why is it that The Roots and The Beastie Boys are the only Rap or HipHop bands that are popularly known for playing live instruments? I&#039;m not saying that all rappers need to know how to play an instrument but imagine what would happen if they all did. There just needs to be a balance. Why hasn&#039;t there ever been a rapper who was incredible at playing guitar like Jimi Hendrix, Steve Vai, Malmsteen,etc. and could also rock the mic like Nas or Biggie or Tupac? Wyclef Jean is trying but he is underappreciated and underated. I was raised on R&amp;B,Soul,Funk,&amp; HipHop, but I am very eclectic. I am a musician who plays Neo-Classical and Prog-Metal and I have met many rappers. Most rappers don&#039;t even know the history of rap and it&#039;s founders beyond the obvious. Most rappers are just entrepreneurs who are just trying to make a hit(not classic) album or make millions of dollars and really are not artists who do it for the love of hiphop as an artform and or culture. Rappers approach me all the time to collaberate but I don&#039;t do it anymore because most are&#039;nt doing anything other than just rapping and not realy doing anything ground breaking or different. And most of the time they try to use you. Lauren Hill became a HipHop Goddess because she could rap well, sing well and play guitar, we need more of that. It would be nice to see and hear a bad ass rapper who could play the sax with an effects pedal during a break,bridge or crescendo of their song. How about a rapper who actually composes music and with an orchestra!!!!!!?? Comon Rappers stop limiting yourselves and take it to the next level.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>HipHop needs to evolve more. Why is it that The Roots and The Beastie Boys are the only Rap or HipHop bands that are popularly known for playing live instruments? I&#8217;m not saying that all rappers need to know how to play an instrument but imagine what would happen if they all did. There just needs to be a balance. Why hasn&#8217;t there ever been a rapper who was incredible at playing guitar like Jimi Hendrix, Steve Vai, Malmsteen,etc. and could also rock the mic like Nas or Biggie or Tupac? Wyclef Jean is trying but he is underappreciated and underated. I was raised on R&amp;B,Soul,Funk,&amp; HipHop, but I am very eclectic. I am a musician who plays Neo-Classical and Prog-Metal and I have met many rappers. Most rappers don&#8217;t even know the history of rap and it&#8217;s founders beyond the obvious. Most rappers are just entrepreneurs who are just trying to make a hit(not classic) album or make millions of dollars and really are not artists who do it for the love of hiphop as an artform and or culture. Rappers approach me all the time to collaberate but I don&#8217;t do it anymore because most are&#8217;nt doing anything other than just rapping and not realy doing anything ground breaking or different. And most of the time they try to use you. Lauren Hill became a HipHop Goddess because she could rap well, sing well and play guitar, we need more of that. It would be nice to see and hear a bad ass rapper who could play the sax with an effects pedal during a break,bridge or crescendo of their song. How about a rapper who actually composes music and with an orchestra!!!!!!?? Comon Rappers stop limiting yourselves and take it to the next level.</p>
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		<title>By: Straight Male Lurker</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/05/16/roth-rockism-hip-hop/#comment-242289</link>
		<dc:creator>Straight Male Lurker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 May 2009 16:22:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/?p=13451#comment-242289</guid>
		<description>I realize that my comment was a little weird.

Jenny Lewis is white.  Just not male.  Mars Volta on the other hand is very diverse, though admittedly an acquired taste.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I realize that my comment was a little weird.</p>
<p>Jenny Lewis is white.  Just not male.  Mars Volta on the other hand is very diverse, though admittedly an acquired taste.</p>
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		<title>By: Straight Male Lurker</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/05/16/roth-rockism-hip-hop/#comment-242286</link>
		<dc:creator>Straight Male Lurker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 May 2009 16:18:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/?p=13451#comment-242286</guid>
		<description>If the issue is straight white men, and the concern is race rather than hip hop specifically, why not introduce him to rock acts that aren&#039;t by white males like Jenny Lewis or Mars Volta?  And it is worth repeating that Freddie Mercury and Elton John are not straight.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If the issue is straight white men, and the concern is race rather than hip hop specifically, why not introduce him to rock acts that aren&#8217;t by white males like Jenny Lewis or Mars Volta?  And it is worth repeating that Freddie Mercury and Elton John are not straight.</p>
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		<title>By: stomper</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/05/16/roth-rockism-hip-hop/#comment-242257</link>
		<dc:creator>stomper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 May 2009 10:07:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/?p=13451#comment-242257</guid>
		<description>like ace and william, i think that there could be plenty of reasons asides from racism why your son dislikes rap.

at the moment, i like to mix in a bit of immortal technique in with the usual burzum and angelspit, but when i was 11-13, i hated rap because:

a) it was what the meat-head &#039;gangstas&#039; who mocked my clothes, hated &#039;homos&#039; and wanted to beat up &#039;bloods&#039; (despite living in central auckland, new zealand, not south-central LA, i went to a &#039;crip&#039; school) listened to.

b) the only rap i&#039;d been exposed to was top 40 bullshit.

c) i preffered metal&#039;s more theatrical style and subject matter                                     

d) as a middleclass, bisexual white/asian girl, i didn&#039;t identify with the lowerclass, heterosexual black men who made rap - it wasn&#039;t music made for, by or about people like me (the same could be said about most metal, but 13 was a very angry age for me, i loved the aggression and the drumming too much to care about the rest).

now, i enjoy rap for the sound and the opportunity to hear the perspectives of people who come from a radically different background to me, but i still don&#039;t feel as emotionally invested in rap and the culture surrounding it as i do with many of the other genres i listen to. the rappers i like sound intelligent, articulate and passionate, but the pasty norwegian satanists sound the way i feel.

critisizing your son&#039;s taste in music will probably make him hate rap more, especially as he approaches the teen years. many people (especially young ones) see the  music they listen to as representing who they are - their values and beliefs - in a symbolic, coded form that isn&#039;t necessarily easy for outsiders to &#039;read&#039;. telling him to change his taste in music will probably make him pretty defensive, especially if he thinks you&#039;re accusing him of being racist. try finding musicians from other genres who project a strong   black identity: bob marley, bad  brains and saul williams come to mind.                                                                                                                                                                         </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>like ace and william, i think that there could be plenty of reasons asides from racism why your son dislikes rap.</p>
<p>at the moment, i like to mix in a bit of immortal technique in with the usual burzum and angelspit, but when i was 11-13, i hated rap because:</p>
<p>a) it was what the meat-head &#8216;gangstas&#8217; who mocked my clothes, hated &#8216;homos&#8217; and wanted to beat up &#8216;bloods&#8217; (despite living in central auckland, new zealand, not south-central LA, i went to a &#8216;crip&#8217; school) listened to.</p>
<p>b) the only rap i&#8217;d been exposed to was top 40 bullshit.</p>
<p>c) i preffered metal&#8217;s more theatrical style and subject matter                                     </p>
<p>d) as a middleclass, bisexual white/asian girl, i didn&#8217;t identify with the lowerclass, heterosexual black men who made rap &#8211; it wasn&#8217;t music made for, by or about people like me (the same could be said about most metal, but 13 was a very angry age for me, i loved the aggression and the drumming too much to care about the rest).</p>
<p>now, i enjoy rap for the sound and the opportunity to hear the perspectives of people who come from a radically different background to me, but i still don&#8217;t feel as emotionally invested in rap and the culture surrounding it as i do with many of the other genres i listen to. the rappers i like sound intelligent, articulate and passionate, but the pasty norwegian satanists sound the way i feel.</p>
<p>critisizing your son&#8217;s taste in music will probably make him hate rap more, especially as he approaches the teen years. many people (especially young ones) see the  music they listen to as representing who they are &#8211; their values and beliefs &#8211; in a symbolic, coded form that isn&#8217;t necessarily easy for outsiders to &#8216;read&#8217;. telling him to change his taste in music will probably make him pretty defensive, especially if he thinks you&#8217;re accusing him of being racist. try finding musicians from other genres who project a strong   black identity: bob marley, bad  brains and saul williams come to mind.                                                                                                                                                                         </p>
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		<title>By: stomper</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/05/16/roth-rockism-hip-hop/#comment-242254</link>
		<dc:creator>stomper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 May 2009 09:22:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/?p=13451#comment-242254</guid>
		<description>like william and ace, i think that your son&#039;s lack of appreciation for rap is necessarily due to racism.at the moment, i like to mix a bit of rap in with my usual metal and harsh dance music, when i was aged 11-13, i hated it with a passion because:

a)it was what the meat-headed &#039;gangstas&#039; who mocked my clothes, talked about beating up &#039;bloods&#039; (dispite being in central auckland, not south-central LA, i went to a &#039;crip&#039; school) and hated &#039;homos&#039; listened to.

b)the only rap i&#039;d been exposed to was top 40 bullshit (i hate most top 40 music, rap, rock and pop).c)it lacked the drama and theatricality of metal (hair-sweat and vikings..mmm...)d)as a middleclass, bisexual white/asian girl, i didn&#039;t identify with the mostly lowerclass, heterosexual black men who make rap - it wasn&#039;t music made for me or about me or by people like me (the same could be said of a great deal of metal, but 13 was a very angry age for me, i loved the aggression and  the drumming too much to care).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>like william and ace, i think that your son&#8217;s lack of appreciation for rap is necessarily due to racism.at the moment, i like to mix a bit of rap in with my usual metal and harsh dance music, when i was aged 11-13, i hated it with a passion because:</p>
<p>a)it was what the meat-headed &#8216;gangstas&#8217; who mocked my clothes, talked about beating up &#8216;bloods&#8217; (dispite being in central auckland, not south-central LA, i went to a &#8216;crip&#8217; school) and hated &#8216;homos&#8217; listened to.</p>
<p>b)the only rap i&#8217;d been exposed to was top 40 bullshit (i hate most top 40 music, rap, rock and pop).c)it lacked the drama and theatricality of metal (hair-sweat and vikings..mmm&#8230;)d)as a middleclass, bisexual white/asian girl, i didn&#8217;t identify with the mostly lowerclass, heterosexual black men who make rap &#8211; it wasn&#8217;t music made for me or about me or by people like me (the same could be said of a great deal of metal, but 13 was a very angry age for me, i loved the aggression and  the drumming too much to care).</p>
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		<title>By: Ferawle</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/05/16/roth-rockism-hip-hop/#comment-242251</link>
		<dc:creator>Ferawle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 May 2009 07:12:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/?p=13451#comment-242251</guid>
		<description>alright, do correct me if I&#039;m wrong.. but your kid obviously has a very feminist mother, and this is bound to be reflected in his stance towards women&#039;s oppressions and objectification of female bodies. If the only hiphop he encounters (which is highly likely)is the kind of hiphop that is accompanied by videos with half naked female bodies crawling around a few guys, well, that might put him off, right? (of course, this isn&#039;t in any way related to the questions why &#039;rockism&#039; is so prevalent. But it might contribute to your kid&#039;s hesitance to listen or appreciate hiphop. and, rock videos can be like that as well. but personally, I know that that type of hiphop has, for a long time, made me want to stay away from the genre altogether.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>alright, do correct me if I&#8217;m wrong.. but your kid obviously has a very feminist mother, and this is bound to be reflected in his stance towards women&#8217;s oppressions and objectification of female bodies. If the only hiphop he encounters (which is highly likely)is the kind of hiphop that is accompanied by videos with half naked female bodies crawling around a few guys, well, that might put him off, right? (of course, this isn&#8217;t in any way related to the questions why &#8216;rockism&#8217; is so prevalent. But it might contribute to your kid&#8217;s hesitance to listen or appreciate hiphop. and, rock videos can be like that as well. but personally, I know that that type of hiphop has, for a long time, made me want to stay away from the genre altogether.)</p>
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		<title>By: jed</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/05/16/roth-rockism-hip-hop/#comment-242239</link>
		<dc:creator>jed</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 May 2009 03:45:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/?p=13451#comment-242239</guid>
		<description>The time has come for kids to wipe both rock and rap off the table and come up with their own damn music.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The time has come for kids to wipe both rock and rap off the table and come up with their own damn music.</p>
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		<title>By: Ace</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/05/16/roth-rockism-hip-hop/#comment-242225</link>
		<dc:creator>Ace</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 May 2009 23:17:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/?p=13451#comment-242225</guid>
		<description>You know, maybe I&#039;m just overreacting to this or something, but it seems to me as if what you are saying is that those of us who don&#039;t like rap and prefer rock must be racist, and that&#039;s simply not true. There are a lot of reasons why I don&#039;t like rap, none of them related to the race of the person making the music:

1. I don&#039;t like electronic music, and most rap tends to be on the electronic side

2. I prefer singing

3. I like guitars

I don&#039;t understand why these preferences makes racist. True, I&#039;m white, and most rock musicians tend to be white, and I&#039;ll admit this is at least partially due to privilege. But I never really see any black people auditioning for rock bands, because they&#039;d rather be apart of rap groups, there&#039;s nothing really wrong with this but it certainly isn&#039;t the rock group&#039;s fault that no black person really wanted to audition. 

Also, I know a lot of rockers who enjoy other forms of black music. I personally like a lot of blues and funk. 

So maybe I&#039;m just misunderstanding this, which happens a lot, still I thought I may as well get my opinion across.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You know, maybe I&#8217;m just overreacting to this or something, but it seems to me as if what you are saying is that those of us who don&#8217;t like rap and prefer rock must be racist, and that&#8217;s simply not true. There are a lot of reasons why I don&#8217;t like rap, none of them related to the race of the person making the music:</p>
<p>1. I don&#8217;t like electronic music, and most rap tends to be on the electronic side</p>
<p>2. I prefer singing</p>
<p>3. I like guitars</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t understand why these preferences makes racist. True, I&#8217;m white, and most rock musicians tend to be white, and I&#8217;ll admit this is at least partially due to privilege. But I never really see any black people auditioning for rock bands, because they&#8217;d rather be apart of rap groups, there&#8217;s nothing really wrong with this but it certainly isn&#8217;t the rock group&#8217;s fault that no black person really wanted to audition. </p>
<p>Also, I know a lot of rockers who enjoy other forms of black music. I personally like a lot of blues and funk. </p>
<p>So maybe I&#8217;m just misunderstanding this, which happens a lot, still I thought I may as well get my opinion across.</p>
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		<title>By: Kathy</title>
		<link>http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/05/16/roth-rockism-hip-hop/#comment-242221</link>
		<dc:creator>Kathy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 May 2009 21:42:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministe.us/blog/?p=13451#comment-242221</guid>
		<description>Lauren,

By developing lesson plans on Arab American and Arab hip hop for students, I developed a much greater appreciation of hip hop in general, and what a revolutionary force (yes, even gangsta rap) it has been for young people throughout the world, and how they have adopted it as the medium to express opposition to injustice, war, corruption, American imperialism, racism, misogyny, etc.  (I have since introduced myself to rappers in Africa and Asia, and rappers of color in Europe. Too. fucking. awesome.). 

Perhaps if your son has an interest in a particular part of the world (ex. - thinks mummies are &quot;cool&quot;), you could intro him to some of these amazing artists. Great music AND great lyrics. And all of these artists will state up front their American influences (Tupac is especially influential), will sample them (and their own indigenous music) in their rap, and some have performed with American artists, or count them as friends. Amazing, amazing stuff. 

For everyone who doesn&#039;t particularly like American hip hop (those who don&#039;t for non-racist reasons), don&#039;t write it off until you have explored the international roots it has spawned among the youth all over the world. Their concerns were always there, but hip hop gave them the musical tools to express it in new and powerful ways. So yes, hip hop IS music and it is universal, and it sucks that so many white people don&#039;t get it, or don&#039;t want to get it, because of their own racist baggage, and that people like Asher are exploiting this baggage for $$$.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lauren,</p>
<p>By developing lesson plans on Arab American and Arab hip hop for students, I developed a much greater appreciation of hip hop in general, and what a revolutionary force (yes, even gangsta rap) it has been for young people throughout the world, and how they have adopted it as the medium to express opposition to injustice, war, corruption, American imperialism, racism, misogyny, etc.  (I have since introduced myself to rappers in Africa and Asia, and rappers of color in Europe. Too. fucking. awesome.). </p>
<p>Perhaps if your son has an interest in a particular part of the world (ex. &#8211; thinks mummies are &#8220;cool&#8221;), you could intro him to some of these amazing artists. Great music AND great lyrics. And all of these artists will state up front their American influences (Tupac is especially influential), will sample them (and their own indigenous music) in their rap, and some have performed with American artists, or count them as friends. Amazing, amazing stuff. </p>
<p>For everyone who doesn&#8217;t particularly like American hip hop (those who don&#8217;t for non-racist reasons), don&#8217;t write it off until you have explored the international roots it has spawned among the youth all over the world. Their concerns were always there, but hip hop gave them the musical tools to express it in new and powerful ways. So yes, hip hop IS music and it is universal, and it sucks that so many white people don&#8217;t get it, or don&#8217;t want to get it, because of their own racist baggage, and that people like Asher are exploiting this baggage for $$$.</p>
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