Unfortunately it happens lots of places.

*is maybe 100 pounds, mixed white/Asian, epileptic with a bracelet, and had both her shoulders dislocated by paramedics. Way to go, EMS!*

I’d love nothing better than for EFA to take this on and pwn their asses, in the technical term.

There’s 3 big lawsuits no hospital or city wants to deal with and I am sure there is a lawyer out there will take them on and win. Can someone please clarify on why they would risk that? She could have died.

Because, to put it bluntly, this is Chicago and no one gives a shit. We’re talking about a woman who is poor, black, and is seen as mentally ill, in the grips of a drug overdose, or so sick she is out of control. She has no power, no influence, and what little care she receives is offered only out of some grudging sense of charity. The police in the area are waiting out their time to be transfered to a “better” area, the same is likely true of the EMTs, and the doctors at whatever hospital she might eventually end up at once the police have made sure that a black woman isn’t “getting away with anything.”

If, by some miracle, she does find a lawyer to take her case she won’t win because the people she is suing have the time and money to simply wait her out or drown her in continuances. All the while she’ll find herself targeted by an essentially unsupervised and out of control police force who will be looking for any way to make this enemy go away. At best she’ll be put under incredible scrutiny, at worst she’ll deal with outright intimidation and abuse.

If her case does somehow make it to court the city will claim immunity and she’ll be fucked. The EMTs will say they did their best when faced with a “crazy black woman.” The hospital will pass the buck on to the city. She’ll be in the position of having to prove that she isn’t crazy, wasn’t on drugs, and wasn’t any more out of control than one might expect from someone having a seizure. She’ll have to convince a jury of people too stupid to avoid jury duty and a judge who is sitting on the bench because he stuck his tongue up the right politician’s asshole.

If her case does somehow make it through all of those hurdles, she’ll probably still lose because judges are easily bought in this town and justice is really something that only a handful of well connected white people get. If it makes it through that charming little system and it looks like she might win, whoever she managed to sue will figure out what pittance will look like a lot of money to a poor person and offer her that (which her lawyer will take a big chunk of) in exchange for a nondisclosure agreement and without admitting any wrongdoing. Nothing will change, nothing will get better.

The world doesn’t work the way it ought to.

I would expect Chicago being a bigger city to also have hospitals with police. Logically, the hospital could still be sued if it was a drug overdose and the person died or wound up with some sort of life-long damage (even short term damage) for not receiving proper care. The hospital would still have the police nearby in case the patient actually got violent or if the patient was assumed to be dangerous. Why risk malpractice and racial discrimination in one shot? Also wouldn’t having epilepsy or a seizure disorder also count as being disabled? There’s 3 big lawsuits no hospital or city wants to deal with and I am sure there is a lawyer out there will take them on and win. Can someone please clarify on why they would risk that? She could have died.

I think you’re reading a little too much into some of that; maybe it wasn’t worded that well but it’s not like the debate about treating or not treating mental illness is so clearcut that you’re a bigot for taking one side of it. Also, I thought it was pretty clear that protection *from themselves and others* was meant, not vice versa. (Do I have to give my mental-cred now? I don’t want to. That’s bullshit.)

I believed I was accounting for those situations.

Because of your lack of knowledge.

I did not say that people with mental illnesses should be left to wander about with no treatment and possibly injure themselves, injure others, or be injured by others. I presumed that being in police custody while being booked would include actions taken to prevent that.

Look, I get that it can be fun to shoot from the hip and wag your fingers on the internet, but if you don’t know what the fuck you’re talking about perhaps you should leave it be. The police are not friendly to most folks on the best of occasions, if you’re a madman, you’re doubly fucked. I know of people who suffocated during a psychotic episode because the police decided to hog-time them so they could get them to the station rather than the ER. I’ve had clients who have brain damage because police let them bang their heads against the wall for a shift and a half. ER shifts deal on a daily basis with mad persons who have been maced, tazed, beaten, shot, and left to stew in their own filth for hours on end before finally getting to the hospital only once the police had padded their arrest stats for the month. I could go on, but basically you’re incorrect in every conceivable way. Incorrect and naive.

I specifically referenced delay in medical treatment, not in action period.

Yeah, but that reference was largely based in ignorance and assumption, so your reference was all but useless.

If there are cases where delaying medical treatment for a mental illness by a few hours is harmful as it can be for strictly physical ailments, as hexy seems to imply, I apologize I was unaware.

If? Interesting wording. Its also interesting that you’re so tied to this idea of mental and physical ailments being easily separated and unrelated. Again, another area where your basic lack of information and understanding undermine your basic argument.

I do not consider removal from a harmful situation and prevention of future harm medical treatment, I consider it common sense and hope it would be the first thing police due regardless of the circumstances.

You’d think this story would have done away with that hope.

Yeah…my use of “seen as a mental illness” was not a synonym in my mind with “faking it,” but rather was supposed to be “seen as faking it by medical professionals who should know better.” But there was an, um, mindkeyboard interface error on my part.

Again, I apologize for my lack of clarity and the hurt/confusion/derailing I caused.