Comments on: But The Animal Companions Are Doin’ It For Themselves http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/10/26/but-the-animal-companions-are-doin-it-for-themselves/ In defense of the sanctimonious women's studies set. Fri, 10 Feb 2012 13:14:04 +0000 hourly 1 By: Az http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/10/26/but-the-animal-companions-are-doin-it-for-themselves/#comment-285421 Az Sun, 01 Nov 2009 06:58:42 +0000 http://www.feministe.us/blog/?p=17077#comment-285421 I agree with Stacy. I really couldn't get past the beginning, where the father is portrayed as a terrible person for wanting his daughter to read about Madame Curie. Little girls don't want to be scientists, they want to be princesses! Terrible movie. And don't get me started on the Disney Princess franchise. I agree with Stacy. I really couldn’t get past the beginning, where the father is portrayed as a terrible person for wanting his daughter to read about Madame Curie. Little girls don’t want to be scientists, they want to be princesses! Terrible movie.

And don’t get me started on the Disney Princess franchise.

]]> By: S.A. Small http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/10/26/but-the-animal-companions-are-doin-it-for-themselves/#comment-285401 S.A. Small Sat, 31 Oct 2009 08:20:37 +0000 http://www.feministe.us/blog/?p=17077#comment-285401 <blockquote>Relevant link: http://www.gearfuse.com/twisted-disney-princesses/</blockquote> Um, not so much, unless you see "gender roles in Disney films" and immediately think "horror genre depictions of female Disney characters."

Relevant link:

http://www.gearfuse.com/twisted-disney-princesses/

Um, not so much, unless you see “gender roles in Disney films” and immediately think “horror genre depictions of female Disney characters.”

]]> By: Rhiannon http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/10/26/but-the-animal-companions-are-doin-it-for-themselves/#comment-285306 Rhiannon Thu, 29 Oct 2009 18:15:13 +0000 http://www.feministe.us/blog/?p=17077#comment-285306 I totally agree with Lisa, especially about Belle! Belle was witty, smart and stubborn - I always liked her best. And if we include the sequels for Cinderella (especially #3) she's way more than a pretty face and you do get to see more of her hidden "bitchy" side or as I like to call it "kick-ass" side. I totally agree with Lisa, especially about Belle! Belle was witty, smart and stubborn – I always liked her best.

And if we include the sequels for Cinderella (especially #3) she’s way more than a pretty face and you do get to see more of her hidden “bitchy” side or as I like to call it “kick-ass” side.

]]> By: Stacy http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/10/26/but-the-animal-companions-are-doin-it-for-themselves/#comment-285209 Stacy Wed, 28 Oct 2009 04:28:19 +0000 http://www.feministe.us/blog/?p=17077#comment-285209 I didn't really like Enchanted. Everyone was telling my how funny and subversive it was, so I watched and discovered that even when disney is making fun of itself, the princess still has to marry SOMEONE (whether it is a modern day prince or a fairy tale). AND it really annoyed me the way the male lead's girlfriend was portrayed. Basically, the message seemed to be "We act all enlightened, but what we really needed was a fairy tale prince/princess to be happy!" I mean, yeah they made fun of the fact that animals help princesses out, but they didn't actually subvert anything. There is still an evil step-mother, still a innocent and good princess despite all the bad things that happen to her, and still a prince who 'saves' her. The fact that it takes place in New York isn't all that subversive. And the feminist, career woman, was also bad with kids. They also made it seem like parenting a girl to be a mature woman and try to keep her away from princess stuff was a horrible thing to do. But of course Disney would think that, they have a corner on the market. Sorry, I was always mad because I was really hoping it would be a better movie than it was. I mean, don't even get me started on Ella Enchanted. I always thought Belle and Jasmine were fairly independent. At least they had minds of their own and were active most of the time instead of passive. I also agree that the Beast was creepy as a real man - the Beast barbie doll that we had was always the bad guy in our games we'd play as a kid. I didn’t really like Enchanted. Everyone was telling my how funny and subversive it was, so I watched and discovered that even when disney is making fun of itself, the princess still has to marry SOMEONE (whether it is a modern day prince or a fairy tale). AND it really annoyed me the way the male lead’s girlfriend was portrayed. Basically, the message seemed to be “We act all enlightened, but what we really needed was a fairy tale prince/princess to be happy!” I mean, yeah they made fun of the fact that animals help princesses out, but they didn’t actually subvert anything. There is still an evil step-mother, still a innocent and good princess despite all the bad things that happen to her, and still a prince who ‘saves’ her. The fact that it takes place in New York isn’t all that subversive. And the feminist, career woman, was also bad with kids. They also made it seem like parenting a girl to be a mature woman and try to keep her away from princess stuff was a horrible thing to do. But of course Disney would think that, they have a corner on the market.

Sorry, I was always mad because I was really hoping it would be a better movie than it was. I mean, don’t even get me started on Ella Enchanted.

I always thought Belle and Jasmine were fairly independent. At least they had minds of their own and were active most of the time instead of passive. I also agree that the Beast was creepy as a real man – the Beast barbie doll that we had was always the bad guy in our games we’d play as a kid.

]]> By: Karalora http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/10/26/but-the-animal-companions-are-doin-it-for-themselves/#comment-285206 Karalora Wed, 28 Oct 2009 03:17:44 +0000 http://www.feministe.us/blog/?p=17077#comment-285206 <i>Sleeping Beauty</i> is much easier to watch from a feminist perspective when you realize that it's not really about Aurora. It's about the three Good Fairies who raise her. They have the most screen time, they protect the prince, they rescue the prince from the villain and ultimately it is their power that defeats her. The prince is little more than decoration. It blew my mind when I realized that <i>Sleeping Beauty</i> passes the Bechdel test. So does <i>Cinderella</i>, come to think of it. I don't think any of the other "princess" films do. Sleeping Beauty is much easier to watch from a feminist perspective when you realize that it’s not really about Aurora. It’s about the three Good Fairies who raise her. They have the most screen time, they protect the prince, they rescue the prince from the villain and ultimately it is their power that defeats her. The prince is little more than decoration.

It blew my mind when I realized that Sleeping Beauty passes the Bechdel test. So does Cinderella, come to think of it. I don’t think any of the other “princess” films do.

]]> By: Erik http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/10/26/but-the-animal-companions-are-doin-it-for-themselves/#comment-285185 Erik Wed, 28 Oct 2009 01:25:48 +0000 http://www.feministe.us/blog/?p=17077#comment-285185 Relevant link: http://www.gearfuse.com/twisted-disney-princesses/ Relevant link:

http://www.gearfuse.com/twisted-disney-princesses/

]]> By: Meg http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/10/26/but-the-animal-companions-are-doin-it-for-themselves/#comment-285179 Meg Wed, 28 Oct 2009 00:39:46 +0000 http://www.feministe.us/blog/?p=17077#comment-285179 Oh, oh! Mulan has a mom! She has a largeish role, too, or at least as large as a role as her family can have considering how much time Mulan spends away from home. Pocahontas' mom is dead too, but she has Grandmother Willow for a mother figure, which is something. I guess. Giselle's not really "excluded" from this pic; she isn't a Disney Princess at all, because they would have to pay royalties to the actress who played her. So every Disney Princess excluded from this picture is a WOC. Oh, oh! Mulan has a mom! She has a largeish role, too, or at least as large as a role as her family can have considering how much time Mulan spends away from home. Pocahontas’ mom is dead too, but she has Grandmother Willow for a mother figure, which is something. I guess.

Giselle’s not really “excluded” from this pic; she isn’t a Disney Princess at all, because they would have to pay royalties to the actress who played her. So every Disney Princess excluded from this picture is a WOC.

]]> By: Kate http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/10/26/but-the-animal-companions-are-doin-it-for-themselves/#comment-285161 Kate Tue, 27 Oct 2009 23:34:14 +0000 http://www.feministe.us/blog/?p=17077#comment-285161 "Snow White: Mom dead Cinderella: Mom dead Sleeping Beauty: Mom alive, with no speaking role, appears in 2 scenes as background Ariel: No mom, no mention of a mom Jasmin: No mom, no mention of a mom Belle: No mom, no mention of a mom" OMG that is so weird I haven't even considered that before. “Snow White: Mom dead
Cinderella: Mom dead
Sleeping Beauty: Mom alive, with no speaking role, appears in 2 scenes as background
Ariel: No mom, no mention of a mom
Jasmin: No mom, no mention of a mom
Belle: No mom, no mention of a mom”

OMG that is so weird I haven’t even considered that before.

]]> By: Lisa http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/10/26/but-the-animal-companions-are-doin-it-for-themselves/#comment-285159 Lisa Tue, 27 Oct 2009 23:27:05 +0000 http://www.feministe.us/blog/?p=17077#comment-285159 Heh, I think the reason why there are barely any mothers in the fairy tales is because mothers are the ultimate protectors and stabilizers. Without one, the world goes wrong, and the hero/heroines have to rely on their wits, magic, or outside help to defeat the wrongness in their world, whatever it may be. It's not really Disney, but the ancient fairy tales that do this. I just don't see how the Disney movies are that awful. So far, I've read about Stockholm Syndrome, BDSM, two-faced misogyny, bad sexuality, etc. in this thread and the other one. Sure, the fairy tales are not perfect (especially the unsanitized ones, yikes!), and the older Disney movies do have some cringe-inducing moments, but I really think that the fairy tales are a reflection of one's own self. What people read into them are what they read into themselves. I think the Disney movies have their negative sides, but the positive intent outweighs that. Take Mulan for example...someone up above said that manliness and violence was shown as positives and feminine frou-frou was shown as negative. Does this mean that real-life female soldiers hate being women? No...Mulan was rebelling against being exactly like every other woman...with her personality buried under the same exact made-up face, manners and abilities. Being honorable for a woman meant being silent and not ruffling any feathers, which Mulan refused to do since there was the greater honor of protecting her father. Mulan never hated being a woman...putting on the armor and pretending to be a man was a means to a end. She was never shown as preferring one over the other. Mulan also failed boot camp until she started using her brains, which led to her having more confidence in her abilities. It was also the very female Mulan who saved the Emperor and was bowed to by everyone in the palace square. The laws deeming women as inferior in China was her main opponent at every turn, and was obviously shown as wrong. If I had a daughter, I would let her watch Disney movies, no problem. I would also let her play with whatever toys she wants to play with, and dress however she wants. If she asks me questions about why doesn't Cinderella do anything, I would have a discussion with her about that and let her take the lead. Heh, I think the reason why there are barely any mothers in the fairy tales is because mothers are the ultimate protectors and stabilizers. Without one, the world goes wrong, and the hero/heroines have to rely on their wits, magic, or outside help to defeat the wrongness in their world, whatever it may be. It’s not really Disney, but the ancient fairy tales that do this.

I just don’t see how the Disney movies are that awful. So far, I’ve read about Stockholm Syndrome, BDSM, two-faced misogyny, bad sexuality, etc. in this thread and the other one.

Sure, the fairy tales are not perfect (especially the unsanitized ones, yikes!), and the older Disney movies do have some cringe-inducing moments, but I really think that the fairy tales are a reflection of one’s own self. What people read into them are what they read into themselves. I think the Disney movies have their negative sides, but the positive intent outweighs that.

Take Mulan for example…someone up above said that manliness and violence was shown as positives and feminine frou-frou was shown as negative. Does this mean that real-life female soldiers hate being women? No…Mulan was rebelling against being exactly like every other woman…with her personality buried under the same exact made-up face, manners and abilities. Being honorable for a woman meant being silent and not ruffling any feathers, which Mulan refused to do since there was the greater honor of protecting her father. Mulan never hated being a woman…putting on the armor and pretending to be a man was a means to a end. She was never shown as preferring one over the other. Mulan also failed boot camp until she started using her brains, which led to her having more confidence in her abilities. It was also the very female Mulan who saved the Emperor and was bowed to by everyone in the palace square. The laws deeming women as inferior in China was her main opponent at every turn, and was obviously shown as wrong.

If I had a daughter, I would let her watch Disney movies, no problem. I would also let her play with whatever toys she wants to play with, and dress however she wants. If she asks me questions about why doesn’t Cinderella do anything, I would have a discussion with her about that and let her take the lead.

]]> By: DOOP http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/10/26/but-the-animal-companions-are-doin-it-for-themselves/#comment-285154 DOOP Tue, 27 Oct 2009 22:50:50 +0000 http://www.feministe.us/blog/?p=17077#comment-285154 this picture is sexist, not the movies. also mulan and Pocahontas are not princesses giselle is not a disney princess, shes a princess in a disney movie tiana's film has yet to be released, she's not yet made it into the club this picture is sexist, not the movies.
also mulan and Pocahontas are not princesses
giselle is not a disney princess, shes a princess in a disney movie
tiana’s film has yet to be released, she’s not yet made it into the club

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