“This next round of elections is going to see a critical mass of severely pissed off individuals wanting to share their pain with the folks who’ve abandoned them—and the only way they can do that is by turning their backs. Hard. ”

Not to mention the fact that a huge percentage of the moderate voters that got Obama elected are independents/republicans like my sister. The existence of a viable female presidential candidate (even if she was the final candidate) and NOT wanting to vote for some ass who speaks of women’s health in air quotes is a big part of why Obama got her vote. The Democrats could have made her that much more likely to keep voting for them if they had stood up for her (and her daughter’s and her sister’s and her mother’s etc.) rights instead of living down to her expectations. As it is, I’m pretty sure she’s back to not trusting a single one of them.

The Dems had a opportunity to shake up the Republican support even further. And they fucking blew it. Simply because they are so short-sided they can’t put themselves into the shoes of people that are not like them.

Don’t underestimate the isolation of the Beltway. They are counting on the dynamic you’ve described—but from what I see and hear on an everyday basis, they’re going to be sorely mistaken.

I hope you’re right, I really do. I’ve just never seen betting against the stupidity, pettiness, ignorance, and fear of human beings pay off. I’d dearly love to eat my words, but I’m fresh out of hope.

I admit, I was one of those Democrats who screamed at people for voting for Nader. I didn’t understand voting for a third party with no chance of winning. For me, voting was the between the lesser of two evils. I didn’t understand that you really aren’t better off choosing the lesser of two evils. You celebrate a victory without examining who you brought home.

In the long term, allowing the lesser evil character to fail is better for us. As much as I hate to think of McCain or Palin in office, with all the damage they can do. But think of what the lesser evil candidate does — he or she doesn’t further health care coverage, doesn’t invest in our educational system, doesn’t rebuild roads and infrastructure, doesn’t expand opportunities for the poor, doesn’t fight for our reproductive rights, doesn’t end wars, doesn’t end unfair policies set in place by predecessors. No, the only “accomplishment” is maintaining the status quo.

I now think it’s better to vote you’re conscience. Build on what you believe in. If we do, in time we could have a viable third party build that is a contender in regional and nation elections. But it will never happen the longer we keep thinking short time. This election cycle. The next presidential race. To be successful we have to think bigger, a generational movement.

Seeing it through this lens, the “evil” candidate is actually a strength for us. He or she serves as the biggest reminder that things aren’t the way they should be and motivates us to fight for a reality more in line with progressive values. Remember how riled up the progressive base was at the end of Bush’s last term? In the short term, it’s a bitter pill to swallow but on the other side is hope. The things we tolerate will not change. We have to stop tolerating the status quo and that start with withdrawing our support from democrats who do not support out values.

Here’s the thing: the progressive wing of the party was pissed off enough in 2000 after eight years of Clinton era NAFTA, DOMA, don’t-ask-don’t-tell, welfare deform, and anti-choice moves that many people voted Green. Not as many as could have–people were genuinely afraid of GWB. But enough did that Gore didn’t win the election. And what happened? Progressives were told that we owed the Dems our votes, that we were being divisive, that everything that happened during the Bush regime was our fault. Not one Democrat stopped to think that, gee, maybe it would have been a good idea to listen to our base–this probably wouldn’t have happened if we did. They were so muddled by their entitlement that it never occurred to them that they should, you know, take this as a lesson.

Don’t underestimate the isolation of the Beltway. They are counting on the dynamic you’ve described—but from what I see and hear on an everyday basis, they’re going to be sorely mistaken.

Except for one thing….the level of political stupidity that is being displayed by the Democratic Party at the national level. Because although the Chicago Machine can be accused of many things, political stupidity ain’t one of ‘em.

I’m not sure it is political stupidity. If theres one thing the Democratic party has learned, its that you can treat your base as poorly as you want because they’ll always know that the other side will be worse. A few individual women might opt not to vote for the dems next time around, but ultimately most who care about abortion will end up voting for the Democrats because the GOP would be worse. Same goes for minorities, same goes for the GLBTQI community, same goes for labor. Vote for the greens and you hand the election to the GOP and get another Bush. Thats the Democrats strategy right now: “Hey, we might be bad, but look at the alternative.”

it’s not like we’re gonna for Tweedledum, but we will be missed when we’re gone. And yes, that will be too late.

I think the Democratic establishment is betting that, come November, women and labor concerns will look at Palin (or Huckabee, or Gingrich, or whatever fresh horrors the GOP has to offer) and flinch. The thing that has me so despondent is that, right now, I’m pretty sure they’re right, what other choice do we have?

Except for one thing….the level of political stupidity that is being displayed by the Democratic Party at the national level. Because although the Chicago Machine can be accused of many things, political stupidity ain’t one of ‘em.

I’m not sure it is political stupidity. If theres one thing the Democratic party has learned, its that you can treat your base as poorly as you want because they’ll always know that the other side will be worse. A few individual women might opt not to vote for the dems next time around, but ultimately most who care about abortion will end up voting for the Democrats because the GOP would be worse. Same goes for minorities, same goes for the GLBTQI community, same goes for labor. Vote for the greens and you hand the election to the GOP and get another Bush. Thats the Democrats strategy right now: “Hey, we might be bad, but look at the alternative.”

it’s not like we’re gonna for Tweedledum, but we will be missed when we’re gone. And yes, that will be too late.

I think the Democratic establishment is betting that, come November, women and labor concerns will look at Palin (or Huckabee, or Gingrich, or whatever fresh horrors the GOP has to offer) and flinch. The thing that has me so despondent is that, right now, I’m pretty sure they’re right, what other choice do we have?

They knew very well that popular opinion was not in favor of them voting for it. And the bill passed anyway.

And yet I don’t think “how can we get the public, and by extention elected officials, to support reproductive freedom?” is a traitorous question to ask;

Don’t put words in my mouth. I never said that asking the question was traitorous–I said that it was moot as public opinion was consistently divided on the issue. I disagreed that more and more people are anti-choice. I pointed out that most of these politicians don’t give a flying fuck what women think–again, witness the lack of women being interviewed on a measure that directly impacts them. Witness the entitlement and whining from politicians now that they’re feeling the blowback from this–they are making it obvious that they don’t give a fuck.

The people I called turncoats were Stupak and the fauxgressives who voted for his regressive, misogynist amendment. I stand by that. When you consistently tell your base that your party is pro-choice and therefore deserves the votes of women, it’s shitty to not only support anti-choice legislation, but to co-author it. When reproductive rights are part of your party’s platform, it’s ridiculous that you co-sponsor an amendment that contradicts that and/or support such an amendment.

Is there no visible progress on corporate pay? There will be, or at least might be, if people stay angry about it long enough. But not if people become convinced that the pay is fair. If perception weren’t important, the term “partial-birth abortion” would never have been promulgated.

People have been pissed off about executive pay and perks for years–this isn’t something that just came on the scene in 2007, FFS. And partial birth abortion was promulgated thanks, in part, to the Dems who knew goddamn well that the proper term was “late term abortion.” Choice activists and just everyday folks who knew this trumpeted this from every street corner and every spire, countless articles and news outlets (which promptly got buried under a sea of right-wing misinformation in the interests of being fair at expense of being accurate). However, if the opposition refuses to listen, and fair-weather allies refuse to amplify and consistently counter the narrative the opposition is pushing, no one will hear.

You’ll just have to forgive me if I’d rather use my energy in supporting people who WILL amplify the message and who WILL fight for me, rather than convince people who call me a baby-killer and a whore that BC, gynocological exams, pre- and post-natal care, EC, and abortion are good things.

The Dems are strongly alienating their (remaining) core constituency, in a futile attempt to attract the support of folks and institutions highly opposed to them. Pissing off large swathes of women and organized labor is not gonna bode well for the next round of elections. Like Sheelz said—it’s not like we’re gonna for Tweedledum, but we will be missed when we’re gone. And yes, that will be too late.

The whole health care bill from top to bottom has become nothing but a sop for the same insurance companies that have been fucking over the U.S. public for decades.

How can you possibly be surprised? A bunch of politicians who are paid the kind of money and receive the kind of benefits you and I will never see pandered to the kinds of people who can keep them on the gravy training rather than working schmucks like us? The same people who have been fucking us over and breaking promises since before either of us were born fucked us over and broke a promise? A fast talking politician from the dirtiest political machine in the country let us down? The populist conservative assholes with the donkey mascot weren’t radically different from the populist conservatives with a elephant mascot? This bill helps primarily big businesses just like the last few hundred thousand have?

“Hope,” like “patriot,” is just another word for “fucked.”